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← Indian village proud after double 'honor killing'

Indian village proud after double 'honor killing' - Comments

black wolf's Avatar Comment 1 by black wolf

Time to play arrest-a-village. But that would be unrespectful, right?

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:12:00 UTC | #171940

Quetzalcoatl's Avatar Comment 2 by Quetzalcoatl

Ah, the caste system. One of the wonderful things about Indian culture. Self-righteous fucktards.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:16:00 UTC | #171944

EvidenceOnly's Avatar Comment 5 by EvidenceOnly

Is there any believer out there who, after reading this, can explain to me why religion is a virtue and deserves even the tiniest bit of respect?

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:17:00 UTC | #171948

Caudimordax's Avatar Comment 4 by Caudimordax

Wow! Sometimes they kill you for marrying outside your village, then sometimes they kill you for marrying inside your village! And here they're killing the man, too. Does that make them more egalitarian?
EDIT
Not explicitly religious beliefs this time, but still crazy "beliefs."

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:17:00 UTC | #171947

RamziD's Avatar Comment 3 by RamziD

Another disgusting act. This is becoming too common.


Just curious, but I wonder why the journalists did not mention which religion these people belong to? They have no problem identifying the religion when it is Islam, and just looking at the names and the discussion about the caste system, it doesn't seem like this is a muslim village. Seems a little like a double standard to me.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:17:00 UTC | #171945

Andrew Stich's Avatar Comment 6 by Andrew Stich

It goes to show how terribly one's interpretation of morality depends on society. I'm sure that not a single person on this site would condone what happened. It's truly shocking, reflecting on how one can actually hold this murder as extremely moral.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:19:00 UTC | #171950

al-rawandi's Avatar Comment 8 by al-rawandi

And they aren't even Muslims.




How will Fanusi figure this one out?

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:21:00 UTC | #171954

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 7 by Cartomancer

Another shocking tale of outdated patriarchal morality. As I read this I started to think "well there's been no mention of islam, and it's India so they're probably some sort of hindus, so clearly you do get this kind of vile crime against humanity without explicit religious sanction for it". Unless there's a kind of hinduism which prescribes such things. There probably is - there's a kind of hinduism that prescribes pretty much anything you like, and if there isn't you can just make up your own and nobody will bat an eyelid.

But to start off on the "is it religion to blame or is it really the underlying cultures that may or may not happen to be overtly religious" road would be missing the point. Clearly the enemy here is deeply ingrained cultural irrationality, plain and simple. Religion is one subset of the phenomenon, this kind of conservative, patriarchal Indian rural culture is another.

Unfortunately, both involve the perpetuation of traditional power structures and modes of oppression - something the powerful and the oppressors will fight tooth and nail to hold on to.

The only ultimate solution I can see to this problem is education in secular, liberal, humanistic values of tolerance, equality, mutual respect and the judging of propositions on evidence rather than the authority of tradition. And increased wealth, access to opportunities and the other core material foundations of a modern society. This is happening, slowly, but it could surely be happening an awful lot more.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:21:00 UTC | #171952

Chris_The_Positivist's Avatar Comment 9 by Chris_The_Positivist

Unbelieveable, another example of the perniciousness of religion. As if there is any justification!!

More often than not those that are vulnerable become victims of such irrational systems. I think it's time women were emancipated from these unjust shackles of oppression. Enough of these cowardly, evil men imposing their will over the innocent.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:26:00 UTC | #171956

Rickshaw's Avatar Comment 11 by Rickshaw

said 48-year-old Satvir Singh. "This was a murder of morality."


This behaviour certainly kills of any claims they may have to morality

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:30:00 UTC | #171958

the great teapot's Avatar Comment 10 by the great teapot

When you consider mankind is a few hundred thousands years old, how far behind our own society is this, a few decades(kkk) may be a couple of centuries ( witch hunts) tops, thats a fraction of our existence as a species let alone a life form. No excuse I know, but we really don't know how good we've got it (in the UK at least) rightnow.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:30:00 UTC | #171957

Chris_The_Positivist's Avatar Comment 12 by Chris_The_Positivist

This is exactly why this is a war worth fighting. The war against irrational belief and the attrocities done in the name of such irrationality.

We will stand for this no longer. We owe it to our 21st century sense of morality, morality far in advance of anything preached by these murderers!

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:37:00 UTC | #171962

RamziD's Avatar Comment 13 by RamziD

Another shocking tale of outdated patriarchal morality. As I read this I started to think "well there's been no mention of islam, and it's India so they're probably some sort of hindus, so clearly you do get this kind of vile crime against humanity without explicit religious sanction for it". Unless there's a kind of hinduism which prescribes such things. There probably is - there's a kind of hinduism that prescribes pretty much anything you like, and if there isn't you can just make up your own and nobody will bat an eyelid.


Just a quick Google search of "caste systems" shows that the idea is rooted in hindu scripture.

Fri, 16 May 2008 12:52:00 UTC | #171970

zosky's Avatar Comment 14 by zosky

my apologies to all the non-chauvunistic males here but stories like these make me passionately dislike men. I grew up in a patriarchial society and have been a direct witness to events like this. Absolutely disgusting! Words are not adequate to express my disgust of such a behavior and such a mindset.

Fri, 16 May 2008 13:23:00 UTC | #171978

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 15 by mordacious1

They "stand defiant behind the act, proud, defiant, almost to a man". "...we have the honor of doing the village proud." Bite me.

Fri, 16 May 2008 13:45:00 UTC | #171984

Jimbesity's Avatar Comment 16 by Jimbesity

I'm supposed to respect this?

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:00:00 UTC | #171989

History_Junky's Avatar Comment 17 by History_Junky

Ive never understood that bloody caste system. Its the 21s century and they are still adhering to beliefs that are millenia old. The problem with hinduism is that rather then dieing out along time ago, they just absorbed new ideas and beliefs that came into India.

This is as bad as when those students committed suicide because colleges were required to have a quota of lower caste students as issued by the government. I sure am happy that my parents made the right decision and got out of that backwards hell hole.

India may be doing well economically but unless they can educate the new generation beyond the caste system then it will be stuck in an economical rut.

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:14:00 UTC | #171991

Marc Weeks's Avatar Comment 18 by Marc Weeks

Doesn't the word "banishment" appear in their dictionaries?

You'll notice they were strangled, which I've always heard is the most personal way of killing someone. It isn't like the relative detachment of shooting someone. To strangle someone, you need to hate them. But if you don't hate them necessarily, then you would to need to feel that you had some sort of sanction to do what you're doing. Enter God, stage left.

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:14:00 UTC | #171992

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 19 by mordacious1

History_Junky

Informative post. Aw, now you've actually put something in so my post looks stupid.

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:15:00 UTC | #171995

devolve's Avatar Comment 20 by devolve

Does anything similar to this occur among non-human* primates like chimps or bonobos, I wonder?





(*leaving aside jokes about these villagers)

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:18:00 UTC | #171998

History_Junky's Avatar Comment 21 by History_Junky

@Mordacious1

I was typing and didnt even realize that I hadnt selected the text box.

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:22:00 UTC | #171999

Mango's Avatar Comment 22 by Mango

To play Devil's avocado for a moment, perhaps these villagers are just very concerned about possible genetic mutations arising from people who procreate within the same shallow gene pool. And this is the inevitable result of possessing a profound understanding of genetics! So science is to blame!

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:35:00 UTC | #172003

rev's Avatar Comment 23 by rev

Mental, mental, fucks

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:36:00 UTC | #172004

Adam Morrison's Avatar Comment 24 by Adam Morrison

re: devolve

It's been a while since I brushed up on primate behaviour, but if I remember correctly the only in-group instances of similar behaviour is chimpanzee males fighting to become alpha and have breeding rights (thought I don't think its usually to the death, submission usually occurs). There have been several instances of inter-group raiding and murder however.


India's caste system is incredibly brutal, I've read about other instances, such as the Japanese Eta (burakamin), where caste/class can result in phenomenally abusive cultural engagements, but India seems to take the cake time and time again. Hopefully as India modernizes this system will quickly disolve, but I'm not betting on it.

Fri, 16 May 2008 14:58:00 UTC | #172013

JimmyL's Avatar Comment 25 by JimmyL

They call themselves men?

I've met a flea ridden, three legged, mongrel bitch that is more manly and more honourable than these pieces of human excrement.

Disgusting.

Fri, 16 May 2008 15:04:00 UTC | #172014

BCReason's Avatar Comment 26 by BCReason

They spread it here to.

In Vancouver a rich Sikh families daughter ran back to India to marry her lower caste boyfriend. The family hired hit men to kill her. The girls Canadian friends have been trying to get the father charged in Canada with setting up the murder.

Fri, 16 May 2008 15:39:00 UTC | #172024

The Schuermannator's Avatar Comment 27 by The Schuermannator

If I had been on that Reuters news team I'd have launched a stick through that fucker on the motorbike's spokes. It would be an "honor throwing" as the motorbike is advanced, Western technology. I don't think Yamaha/Suzuki/Honda would want it any other way. =)


~Matt

Fri, 16 May 2008 15:50:00 UTC | #172025

Noodly's Avatar Comment 28 by Noodly

Of course these honour killings are cultural, but when did you last hear the local religious leaders condemn these actions?

More than anything, these sad events point out that religion is a man made cultural phenomenon.

Fri, 16 May 2008 16:29:00 UTC | #172038

Diocletian's Avatar Comment 29 by Diocletian

So glad British Airways is banning beef on their flights in order to respect those of the Hindu faith. Perhaps we all ought to send this article to them and ask them why we should pay them respect?

Fri, 16 May 2008 18:33:00 UTC | #172064

Diocletian's Avatar Comment 30 by Diocletian

To zosky

I hate to rain on your parade of male chauvunism, but women buy into this too. The last thing we need is to start dividing religion along lines of sex and start blaming one sex being more responsible than another. Who in 'heaven's name' do you think raises these boys who become men who kill for family honour. And please don't think that the women don't want these killings to occur - after all, they have other daughters to marry off and how can they marry if shame has come to their family? It is all wrapped up in promoting our own genes. Does that justify such murders? Absolutely not - but please - let's not make this a sexist issue - let's keep the blame where it should be - RELIGION.

Fri, 16 May 2008 18:39:00 UTC | #172065