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← George W Bush meets Pope amid claims he might convert to Catholicism

George W Bush meets Pope amid claims he might convert to Catholicism - Comments

Neuro's Avatar Comment 1 by Neuro

I laugh at how simply people can convert... you know, uproot their 'current' beliefs and switch to some new ones. It's like buying a car: trade your old car in, test drive some new cars, then buy a new one [and repeat in the next 10 years].

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:14:00 UTC | #183801

Dhamma's Avatar Comment 2 by Dhamma

Is the ability to convert a virtue or not? Sure, this is within the same religion, but I have generally seen it as a strenght to be able to give up your belief for another. Maybe I should reconsider.

Edit: Same shit, different name still applies to this conversion though.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:16:00 UTC | #183804

ThoughtsonCommonToad's Avatar Comment 3 by ThoughtsonCommonToad

"Anything is possible, especially for a born-again Christian such as Bush."
How True.
..."on ethical matters he has always had a line that is practically identical to that of the Vatican." Mr Bush has spoken out against gay marriage, abortion and stem cell research. He proposed amending the US constitution to "fully protect marriage" as the "union of man and woman as husband and wife".
Also the wonderful abstinence only program in Africa.
Catholics have noted that during the contested election in 2000, Jeb Bush travelled to Mexico and prayed to the icon of Our Lady of Guadelupe. His victory was announced by the Supreme Court on December 12, the feast day of the Lady of Guadelupe.
Wow Bush really is doing God's will.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:18:00 UTC | #183805

Laurie Fraser's Avatar Comment 4 by Laurie Fraser

Bush might like to try converting to human, first...

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:20:00 UTC | #183807

kraut's Avatar Comment 5 by kraut

What a pleasure for the RCC - another war criminal joins its ranks. How proud must the benedict be.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:22:00 UTC | #183808

mikecbraun's Avatar Comment 6 by mikecbraun

In other news, George Bush got a tattoo of a Jolly Roger on his left pec, so Tony Blair is considering what he will get. Sources say he is most likely to choose a butterfly on the small of his back, which will be visible when he wears a tube top in summer.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:16:00 UTC | #183831

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 7 by mordacious1

Now, if I was a conspiracy nut, I would note that 5 of the Supreme Court Justices are catholic, Blair's catholic, Bush may become catholic...we've got Fanusi ready to wage the Crusades again...

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:23:00 UTC | #183834

Apathy personified's Avatar Comment 8 by Apathy personified

Strange, how absolutely 'right' people are about their religions, no doubt in their mind until.... 'actually boys, change of direction, it's the catholics, NOT the methodists who are right'

I hope this turns out to be true, then both Blair and Bush will have shown more loyalty to their brand of toothpaste (colgate - it's what made them best friends in the early days - no, seriously, i shit you not), than the entire protestant movement, suck on that Martin Luther.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:31:00 UTC | #183838

Star Spangled Eagle's Avatar Comment 9 by Star Spangled Eagle

In other news...


I am converting to Pastafarianism.

Would anyone else like to touch HIS noodly appendage?

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:39:00 UTC | #183841

joshie's Avatar Comment 10 by joshie

If George W really converts to Catholicism because the Pope visited and impressed him then that just shows how ignorant he is. What about the centuries of theological difference between Protestants and Catholics? This smacks of following the cult of personality.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:44:00 UTC | #183844

HitbLade's Avatar Comment 11 by HitbLade

When I worked in Thailand, I know a guy who converted from christianity to buddhism. I suppose it makes more sense to worship a dead guy than a guy who never existed. I could convert to George Carlin's religion and worship the sun and pray to Joe Pesci. (Did I get the names right? :P)

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 16:57:00 UTC | #183849

thewhitepearl's Avatar Comment 12 by thewhitepearl

HitbLade,

[most] buddhists dont actually worship a dead guy. I think most christians "convert" to buddhism as a stepping stone. It IS possible to be a christian and buddhist

Mordacious1,

"we've got Fanusi ready to wage the Crusades again..."

Ahh but remember the Crusades was a walk in the park compared to the damage inflicted by the mighty Mohammed and his modern day followers.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:05:00 UTC | #183853

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 13 by mordacious1

thewhitepearl

Oh, yeah that's right. Those were the good ol' days.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:35:00 UTC | #183861

Gordy's Avatar Comment 14 by Gordy

So, it looks like Blair did have some influence over Bush after all... *sigh*

And, yes, some forms of Buddhism, such as Zen, don't involve any belief in the supernatural nor any worship of a deity (or even a "dead guy"). As I understand Zen, it's not really a religion, but a simple practice that encourages mental well-being.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:45:00 UTC | #183864

catskill's Avatar Comment 15 by catskill

It costs an absolutely insane amount of money for the Pres to travel abroad. And the only reason given for the travel is that he is on a farewell tour? Plus he gets to meet his superhero the Pope. Wonderful.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:04:00 UTC | #183868

acs's Avatar Comment 16 by acs

How is this a suprise, the biggest con artists in history go after the biggest sucker.

Obama in 08 ;)

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:14:00 UTC | #183869

black wolf's Avatar Comment 17 by black wolf

Most religious believers are the type of person who seeks an authority to tell him what is absolutely right and wrong, they crave certainty. George W. is sick and tired of being a leader, and I'm sure he does know that he is widely considered a failure at that. How relieving it must be for him to find the one person in the world many people believe to be the highest authority after the one who doesn't answer. If he does convert, he gives the evangelicals and other fundamentalist Protestants one more justification, one man they can call a traitor, to call for a new Cold War of reformation, or even make a stand against what they believe to be the new Great Whore, the Anti-Christ of Rome. The Pope rejects the idea of ecumenical service anyway. Another few decades or more of religion starving in the West, and the death throes may spark another rekindling of the battle for the remaining believers. If we're lucky, the believers will finally turn away from organized religion, and if we're even more lucky, they won't turn to woo instead.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:18:00 UTC | #183870

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 18 by mordacious1

GW is going to have to get his mom's permission, because she runs that family. She might look like the Quaker Oats guy, but she is a bulldog. I doubt if this is going to happen until mom drops dead.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:23:00 UTC | #183871

dragonfirematrix's Avatar Comment 19 by dragonfirematrix

Religion sure is strange.

If only the religious would convert to the truth. The planet might be better place.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:24:00 UTC | #183874

Paskoo's Avatar Comment 20 by Paskoo

For the life of me, I cannot understand the "converts."

I can certainly understand for someone to have a religion because it is "Daddy's shit" and therefore it becomes mine.

But, what is beyond me is that why would someoe leave his own shit and take someone else's shit?.


Farooq

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:38:00 UTC | #183880

Grantaire of JC's Avatar Comment 21 by Grantaire of JC

I'd be impressed to receive such a honor too! To meet the head of the Catholic Church the institution that has helped millions of poor people, and at the same time stood firm in insisting that their God is the one and only, thus causing a religious strife that won't resolved for generations!! Maybe he felt in true awe of the power of government. Maybe his own religious doubts are driving him to Catholicism. But maybe, just maybe, he's looking for a little absolution for his sins and the Pope can make him be more at peace. If that's what works for him good luck.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:39:00 UTC | #183881

Count von Count's Avatar Comment 22 by Count von Count

Ah,... I can see it now...

Priest: "Do you believe in God the Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth?"
George 'Corleone' Bush: "I do."
Priest: "Do you believe in Jesus Christ, His only Son, Our Lord?"
Bush: "I do."
Priest: "Do you believe in the Holy Ghost and the Holy Catholic Church?"
Bush: "I do."
Priest: "Do you renounce Satan?"
Bush: "I do renounce him."
Priest: "And all his works?"
George: "I do renounce them."
Priest: "And all his pomps?"
Bush: "I do renounce."
Priest: "George 'Corleone' Bush, will you be baptized?"
Michael: "I will."
Priest: "In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit go in peace, and may the Lord be with you."

(Scenes of Iraqi war, Katrina, and Guantanamo playing in the background of course.)

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:43:00 UTC | #183884

mikecbraun's Avatar Comment 23 by mikecbraun

catskill makes a good point. The rest of us suckers have to start paying to check in bags and shell out two bucks for a thimble-full of coke, but the president can go jet-setting all over the face of the Earth for this kind of b.s.? Hey Bush--don't ever mention responsible energy use and energy conservation again, not when you're wasting hundreds of gallons of fuel to go talk to an elderly Nazi who sits around in his bathrobe and carries a jeweled sceptre about ways to further your relationship with an imaginary man in the sky. It just doesn't jive with 21st-century reality, man.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:44:00 UTC | #183885

Grantaire of JC's Avatar Comment 24 by Grantaire of JC

Nicely done Count!

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:45:00 UTC | #183886

MPhil's Avatar Comment 25 by MPhil

go talk to an elderly Nazi


Ratzinger may be many things - but a Nazi is not one of them. Not everyone who was in the German Army back then was a Nazi... you practically didn't have a choice. Also, remember that the children back then were indoctrinated everywhere - in school, university, possibly at home and in the Hitler Youth.

Many of them turned out to be prime examples of defenders of democracy once the de-nazification was complete.

Don't blame it on them, not really fair.

Ratzinger is a very proficient thinker - there is no doubt about that. A very good thinker holding a position that's totally nuts, and immoral to boot. It's not like that has never happened before or since (just look at Swinburne, Craig, Plantinga etc).

Actually, Ratzinger used to be among the most progressive catholic officials... He even was partially responsible for the huge modernizations the catholic church underwent in Vatican II - but then the '68 revolution wrecked havoc at the university he was teaching at and used physical violence to interrupt learning - and he turned staunch conservative.

I don't like him any more than any atheist on here - but he is definitely not a Nazi.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:55:00 UTC | #183889

MPhil's Avatar Comment 26 by MPhil

He definitely looks like Palpatine... and on a slightly related note - I loved the vid where they dubbed a report on a huge catholic ceremony to be about some alien, Star Wars-like cult. It was hilarious.


Say, Brian - I forgot - did I already send you my paper on "The Limits of Religion in a Liberal Society"?

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:01:00 UTC | #183893

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 27 by mordacious1

MPhil

Joining the Hitler Youth was a choice was it not? Not every kid in Germany was in the Hitler Youth.

Now he's just been promoted. If he was "indoctrinated" in the HY, maybe he learned alot about indoctrination of the young there. Makes him a good pope, I suppose.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:02:00 UTC | #183894

MPhil's Avatar Comment 28 by MPhil

Joining the Hitler Youth was a choice was it not?


It was definitely not the free choice of the child - and the social pressure on those who did not enlist their children into the Hitler Youth (not to mention on the children - being a social outcast in Nazi-Germany definitely wasn't easy. The first to be sent to the concentration camps were the socialists, not the Jews. They came later) was so enormous that I don't blame the "ordinary" parents either.

If he was "indoctrinated" in the HY, maybe he learned alot about indoctrination of the young there. Makes him a good pope, I suppose.


If you want to be really historically correct and use the abbreviation, it would be "HJ"... but that doesn't matter.

Anyway, I think having witnessed such indoctrination made him a far better priest and preacher than a pope. The pope rarely has to indoctrinate people - the lower levels do that mostly, those in direct contact with the congregation. But I think his knowledge of rhetoric, his proficiency in argumentation, his being an intellectual and his knowing about indoctrination certainly helped him "ascend" through the ranks.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:10:00 UTC | #183899

MPhil's Avatar Comment 29 by MPhil

Brian,
Ah - I knew the IP was from Australia, but it might just have been somebody else :)

I just sent you a proper E-Mail with the Paper as plain PDF-attachment.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:13:00 UTC | #183901

MPhil's Avatar Comment 30 by MPhil

Also, interestingly - I just tried both download-links and they seem to work fine from here.

Weird.

Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:17:00 UTC | #183903