This site is not maintained. Click here for the new website of Richard Dawkins.

← Educated Catholics have sown dissent and confusion in the Church, claims bishop

Educated Catholics have sown dissent and confusion in the Church, claims bishop - Comments

wiz220's Avatar Comment 1 by wiz220

Congrats to the UK! You now have "anti-intellectualism" being preached over there too! And here I thought it was unique to the U.S.

Someone needs to tell this nutter that the ship has sailed, he'll need to get used to the fact that talk like this will only marginalize himself and his organization further.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:35:00 UTC | #271452

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 2 by Cartomancer

I haven't laughed so much in ages. Finally, someone on the other side realises that modern education is corrosive to religion. Long may the cloisters of academe continue to empty the cloisters of the faithful.

But he really does pick on universities unnecessarily. It barely takes GCSE-level education to realise what bunkum religion is.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:37:00 UTC | #271453

SimplyIrresponsible's Avatar Comment 3 by SimplyIrresponsible

Well, I think this sums it up ... and straight from the horse's mouth as it were. The Church doesn't want educated people.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:38:00 UTC | #271454

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 4 by Cartomancer

Though it does strike me as spectacularly arrogant that someone who never went to university and spent his entire education in seminaries presumes to call himself a moral authority over and above those who have actually devoted their time to serious academic study of relevant disciplines.

He might also be acutely embarrassed to learn that his beloved Pope Ratpoison was himself a university professor at Munster, Tubingen and Regensburg from 1951-1977. Then again, he appears to be acutely embarassed to learn anything.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:43:00 UTC | #271456

lastgreek's Avatar Comment 5 by lastgreek

Well, I think this sums it up ... and straight from the horse's mouth as it were. The Church doesn't want educated people.

Perhaps that explains the addition of Tony Blair to the fold.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:49:00 UTC | #271457

eean's Avatar Comment 6 by eean

This guy needs to watch,3342,Hitchens-v-Albacete---Excerpts,AlecsDeLarge-Christopher-Hitchens and perhaps realize some of their own priests aren't necessarily towing the party line. :D

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:04:00 UTC | #271458

black wolf's Avatar Comment 7 by black wolf

What a pathetic whiner. He's losing, his dogma has been losing for ages, and he's shit-scared to admit it.

oh, and by the way, it's 'toeing the line', not towing.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:19:00 UTC | #271459

Adam Morrison's Avatar Comment 8 by Adam Morrison

Ummm.... the 'educated' people are 'egocentric'.

One would think that believing that the creator of the universe has a special interest in your life, in one individual among the infinite number of lifeforms in the universe, is the height of egocentrism.

But maybe it's just me...

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:34:00 UTC | #271460

gyokusai's Avatar Comment 9 by gyokusai

This is from The Onion, right?


Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:45:00 UTC | #271461

epeeist's Avatar Comment 10 by epeeist

Comment #285239 by black wolf

oh, and by the way, it's 'toeing the line', not towing.
Well yes it is, but it did make me wonder where he was towing it to.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:47:00 UTC | #271462

ADParker's Avatar Comment 11 by ADParker

Ah, I just love it when the Faith-heads unwittingly make our argument for us.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:53:00 UTC | #271463

Lisa Bauer's Avatar Comment 12 by Lisa Bauer

...I suppose there needs to be a crack here somewhere about how Catholics who are truly "educated" demonstrate this by leaving the Church altogether? ;-) Though I'm not quite sure how to word that...

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:02:00 UTC | #271464

GarrickW's Avatar Comment 13 by GarrickW

Sickening, really. I've always wondered whether the reason "Anti-Catholicism" is actually a thing people are accused of is that Catholics have a higher total sum of numbers and nuttiness. At least he admits that education makes people less inclined to believe in his god.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:09:00 UTC | #271465

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 14 by aquilacane

holy fuck

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:25:00 UTC | #271467

black wolf's Avatar Comment 15 by black wolf

If that was my dogma and my religion, providing me with a fat wallet, a house and a housekeeper, with no other work to do but publicly announce the newest platitudes and no-sequiturs I've thought up, and writing essays that consist of assemblies of fragments of other people's work - I'd excommunicate anyone with an academic education before the whole nice scheme goes down the drain. Except for those academics who are content with playing along.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:29:00 UTC | #271468

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 16 by aquilacane

Basically, the more people learn the harder it is to lie to them. Is this guy an idiot, or does he honestly think we all are?

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:30:00 UTC | #271469

WilliamP's Avatar Comment 17 by WilliamP

To be a member of the Catholic Church one must believe that:
1. Humans can give birth without having sex.
2. A dead person can come back life.
3. Bread and wine can turn into the body and blood of a man who died nearly 2000 years ago.
4. There is both only one god, and at the same time, three.
5. Snakes can talk.

Are they really surprised that they their educated members are giving them trouble' Then again, anyone dumb enough to believe this crap might be.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:34:00 UTC | #271470

Szkeptik's Avatar Comment 18 by Szkeptik

Uh, right...
It doesn't get any more stupid than this.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:35:00 UTC | #271471

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 19 by aquilacane

How can you tell if a Catholic is educated?

They're an atheist!

Joke courtesy of Bishop O'Donoghue

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:35:00 UTC | #271472

black wolf's Avatar Comment 20 by black wolf

I think he's actually neither. He's a bridge-burner. The issues itch and bother him, so he's decided to go all-in, throw the papers in the air and open a window. This is the moment when he ponders whether to jump or do something really crazy. Let's watch and wait. Popcorn, anyone?

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:36:00 UTC | #271473

Boukeb's Avatar Comment 21 by Boukeb

Taken together, these intellectual trends have resulted in a fragmented society that marginalizes God, with many people mistakenly thinking they can live happy and productive lives without him.

So I am living my life happily without the notion of a god (even the more happier to be as far away from religion as I can) but I am mistaken'

This sort of crazy talk should be treated as Hitchens once said, not by debating but simply repeating it.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:38:00 UTC | #271474

astronomer24's Avatar Comment 22 by astronomer24


This sure sounds like an article the Onion would put out which makes is all the more comical that it is a real article.

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:48:00 UTC | #271475

Laurie Fraser's Avatar Comment 23 by Laurie Fraser

Comment #285244 by Layla Nasreddin

I'd put it this way, Layla: "Catholics who are truly educated demonstrate this by leaving the church altogether." Nothing wrong with that, is there?

Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:53:00 UTC | #271476

j s bach's Avatar Comment 24 by j s bach

And if Prince Charles ever ascends the throne - the law may change and permit the monarch to marry a Roman Catholic - which could in time lead to a Roman Catholic as the king or queen. That will enhance the power of nutters like this bishop no end. Zeus help us.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:07:00 UTC | #271477

Evilcor's Avatar Comment 25 by Evilcor

You want "happy and productive"? Try meth; you'll save in the long run, I promise.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:08:00 UTC | #271478

Laurie Fraser's Avatar Comment 26 by Laurie Fraser

But how does this stack up as idiocy at its finest:

"However, every human endeavor has a dark side, due to original sin and concupiscence. In the case of education, we can see its distortion through the widespread dissemination of radical scepticism, positivism, utilitarianism and relativism."

So, on this logic we have lust responsible for, say, scepticism. No wonder the educated are leaving in droves.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:12:00 UTC | #271479

Evilcor's Avatar Comment 27 by Evilcor

Nobody knows lust like a Utilitarian.
Jeremy Bentham was hung like a moose!

And BTW, I've about had it with this Lefty McStrawman caricature of "relativism". If any of you have ever actually SEEN an actual relativist, drop a line and let someone know.

Frankly I think superior cultures like ours could do with a bit of the dread relativism. . . might get a bit harder to bomb the next wogs.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:20:00 UTC | #271480

AllanW's Avatar Comment 28 by AllanW

I love it; more proof that clerics are desparate. A number of people have summarised the more risible parts of this article but the net result is to confirm what I've always thought; education rots religion.

As for 'toeing the line', I'm sure we all remember that this phrase is supposed to come from the discipline in British Naval vessels of mustering to divisions. The officer in charge of a division of crew on the ship presented his men for inspection by the Captain by getting them to form a line by pointing to one of the grooves on the planked deck.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:26:00 UTC | #271481

geckoman's Avatar Comment 29 by geckoman

I'm sure the Bish is correct and I'm glad he is.

The flipside to the decline in belief among the educated is to some extent the growth in belief among the uneducated. Here in Swaziland Christianity is absolutely thriving and it pervades every aspect of life. It is no coincidence that missionaries continue to flock here-not that they are needed, but at least they are not the laughing stocks they are in the developed world. The elites in countries like this deliberately promote religion while simultaenously under-investing in education as a means to hold onto their positions of privilege while keeping the populace subdued. For example, the King is portrayed as chosen by God, so to oppose him and his puppet Government is nealtly equated with sin. The 'helpful' missionaries probably don't realise that to quite a degree they are perpetuating inequality.

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:32:00 UTC | #271482

dochmbi's Avatar Comment 30 by dochmbi

"Do you find it risible?"

Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:33:00 UTC | #271483