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← Creationists don't deserve credence--especially from Forbes.

Creationists don't deserve credence--especially from Forbes. - Comments

popeye's Avatar Comment 1 by popeye

This guys says


"claims of evolutionary biologists go wildly beyond the evidence." Indeed, he says, the only way complex biological systems such as biochemical pathways could have arisen is via direct divine intervention


How does he explain spiecies that we see evolving today? I haven't seen god around doing that work....maybe I am just missing him. I am never going to trust this guy with my brain!

Edit: I am talking about Egnore, not Coyne, just to clarify. I just started reading his book and it is great.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:35:00 UTC | #324293

Quine's Avatar Comment 2 by Quine

In an article on this site, "A Neurosurgeon, Not A Darwinist," he claims that the theory of evolution is bogus.
**Picks jaw up off table**

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:43:00 UTC | #324296

evilekin's Avatar Comment 3 by evilekin

Sounds like this guy took the online course for neurosurgery and did the homework on his own brain. To claim evolution is bogus outright is tantamount to claiming the Theory of gravity is bogus after getting hit in the face with bird shit. Both statements leave you looking foolish.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:51:00 UTC | #324303

beanson's Avatar Comment 4 by beanson

What is it with these brain surgeons? We were just commenting a few days back about that nut Benjamin Carson, a colleague of this guy.

Is there like a fundamentalist neuro-surgeon college somewhere in the deep south?

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:51:00 UTC | #324304

NewEnglandBob's Avatar Comment 5 by NewEnglandBob

Most of these guys (surgeons) are just plumbers these days.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:55:00 UTC | #324307

Tezcatlipoca's Avatar Comment 6 by Tezcatlipoca

There are plenty in the field who disagree with Egnor. Dr Novella for example.

http://www.theskepticsguide.org/

http://www.theness.com/neurologicablog/

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:13:00 UTC | #324323

Cliff Melick's Avatar Comment 7 by Cliff Melick

The only thing Egnor proves is that is possible to become a physician and remain totally ignorant about biology.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:53:00 UTC | #324350

Corylus's Avatar Comment 8 by Corylus

<!-- -->

In an article on this site, "A Neurosurgeon, Not A Darwinist," he claims that the theory of evolution is bogus.
OK - found it here, for those that are curious.

What depresses me about this is that the problem is not only that people hold false beliefs* there is also the issue of false beliefs leading people to avoiding new sources of information.

For example, will he be reading any books on Darwinian medicine anytime soon? I'm thinking not.

---
*We must all admit to ourselves this probability - I'm sure I am wrong on all manner of things.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:53:00 UTC | #324351

Skutter's Avatar Comment 9 by Skutter

Foxy - it's never wasted time.

There's a larger audience out there. Aim for them and ignore the deluded ones.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:44:00 UTC | #324380

TIKI AL's Avatar Comment 11 by TIKI AL

Sad that a neurosurgeon could be so Egnorant.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:00:00 UTC | #324387

Wosret's Avatar Comment 10 by Wosret

Publications, universities, and other such platforms really do have to start ignoring these clowns.

Let them preach their nonsense in their churches.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:00:00 UTC | #324386

righton's Avatar Comment 12 by righton

Many neurosurgeons think they are god.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:07:00 UTC | #324388

TomGoodfellow's Avatar Comment 13 by TomGoodfellow

"the evidence for all of them is not only strong but copious--so much so that evolution has graduated from a scientific theory to a scientific fact."

This is clumsy - Coyne should be explaining that a theory is more than a mere fact, not ceding ground to those who wish to misuse the term.

Otherwise, good stuff.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:08:00 UTC | #324389

righton's Avatar Comment 14 by righton

It's funny when a doctor or scientist believes in god. The faith heads think it somehow validates their beliefs and makes them feel smarter somehow. Then they hold up their token scientist/doctor for everyone to see, failing to mention he is in the overwhelming minority.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:11:00 UTC | #324391

Caudimordax's Avatar Comment 15 by Caudimordax

11. Comment #340125 by Foxy

I don't know what these creationists need to convince them. Evidence just doesn't seem to do the trick. Maybe they need their brains rewired - but certainly not by this guy!

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:13:00 UTC | #324393

Mark Jones's Avatar Comment 16 by Mark Jones

Coyne says:


This, in effect, is what Forbes has done by giving equal time to evolution-deniers. Journalists have an obligation to be fair, but this doesn't mean that they must give charlatans a prestigious platform from which to broadcast their lies. By doing so, Forbes has debased both journalism and science.

It's aggressive ignorance or audacious mendacity that is displayed by these apologists for ID, and Coyne is right to call out Forbes on this.

I made a similar comment about a nonsensical letter to the Telegraph; the press defend the coverage by demanding a *balance* of opinions, but there is no balance between good sense and nonsense. It's about time they stood up for *good* sense, and against *nonsense*.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 15:45:00 UTC | #324413

gadders59's Avatar Comment 17 by gadders59

Mr Egnor states:-

Why do Darwinists--scientists--seek recourse in federal courts to silence criticism of their theory in public schools? What is it about the Darwinian understanding of biological origins that is so fragile that it will not withstand scrutiny by schoolchildren?

Maybe it's because scientists prefer children to be educated.
Teaching children Creationism or ID as an alternative to Darwinism is akin to teaching a dead language as a viable alternative to a living one.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 16:29:00 UTC | #324429

mind hypnotized's Avatar Comment 18 by mind hypnotized

"claims of evolutionary biologists go wildly beyond the evidence." Indeed, he says, the only way complex biological systems such as biochemical pathways could have arisen is via direct divine intervention


Yes, because there is SO MUCH EVIDENCE for not only the existence of a divine being, but a divine being who is just so obviously a biochemist. Seriously, how is "goddidit" not a claim that is wildly beyond the evidence'

This poor man seems to be confusing his lack of imagination for a conceptual impossibility. Just because he can't understand evolution doesn't mean it is wrong. It just means he hasn't tried.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 16:38:00 UTC | #324434

gadders59's Avatar Comment 19 by gadders59

Comment #340180 by Foxy
Don't you just love people like GodsSoldier105?

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 16:57:00 UTC | #324438

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 20 by aquilacane

already mocked this guy

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:12:00 UTC | #324442

kenny756's Avatar Comment 21 by kenny756

A freaking neurosurgeon!? Surley a neurosurgeon would have to appreciate how a brain has evolved in order to understand it better. What is going on for cryin' out loud.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:22:00 UTC | #324443

Hellene's Avatar Comment 22 by Hellene

Foxy,

When satan is evoked what they are telling you is that you are considered less than human. That way rational thought is tucked neatly away and the perceived threat can be dealt with.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:42:00 UTC | #324447

Eshto's Avatar Comment 23 by Eshto

A freaking neurosurgeon!? Surley a neurosurgeon would have to appreciate how a brain has evolved in order to understand it better. What is going on for cryin' out loud.


Does a mechanic need to know the history of the automobile industry in order to fix a car?

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:55:00 UTC | #324449

aragones's Avatar Comment 24 by aragones

Why on earth this guys are always having antiDarwinian revelations? Let me guess, he's a new born Christian...


hehe
I've fount another anti egnorance text in panda's thumb site:
http://pandasthumb.org/archives/2007/03/egnorance-combo-arrogance.html

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:12:00 UTC | #324458

Marku's Avatar Comment 25 by Marku

The only evidence this neurosurgeon brings to the table is that even the most educated people can be absolutely retarded in a field they were never trained in. I bet this guy doesn't even know how to make macaroni and cheese, or work a washing machine.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:19:00 UTC | #324459

aragones's Avatar Comment 26 by aragones

27. Comment #340195 by Eshto
"Does a mechanic need to know the history of the automobile industry in order to fix a car?"


Challenge:
Could Someone give an example of how the knowledge of brain evolution could one day be usefull to fix a brain?

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:34:00 UTC | #324460

HappyPrimate's Avatar Comment 27 by HappyPrimate

I am by far not the smartest pea in the pod but it was not that difficult to educate myself, even without the benefit of a university education, on evolution and how obvious the evidence was for the truth of it. I think these so-called educated people who refuse to even look at the evidence or dismiss it just don't want it to be true. They really enjoy their myth and refuse to budge from it. They have abandoned their ability for reason and rational thinking on purpose. Nothing will ever be able to penatrate their self-imposed delusion. In my view, it is a form of madness. I've seen people who will refuse to believe a loved one has died even if you show them the body. Same thing.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:57:00 UTC | #324465

quantum_flux's Avatar Comment 28 by quantum_flux

Well, hopefully the guy compensates for his ignorance of science with real good hand-eye coordination and the ability to remove brain tumors safely without lobotomizing people. After all, though, understanding evolutionary theory is not all that pertanent to understanding how to use a scapel or to design an airplane, actually they are quite different domains of knowledge. I find it quite amusing that Werner Von Braun was a Lutheran, or that Francis Collins was the leader of the Human Genome Project after all, believing in a divine being and all that.

Now, if I could just stomach it, I would listen to what this guy (retired electrical engineer) has to say:

George Shollenberger

But I can't, so I won't. I meet these religious people in science all the time, somehow they just don't get that God is incompatable with science.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 20:57:00 UTC | #324490

DiveMedic's Avatar Comment 29 by DiveMedic

Sadly, there are a great deal of religious nuts in the healthcare field. Many of them that I work with can be rather pushy about their beliefs. I have searched for an atheist healthcare providers organization/group of some sort, but have never found one.

From the reactions I have gotten from co-workers, I have a feeling such a group would not last long if it made itself known.

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 23:17:00 UTC | #324499

Greyed's Avatar Comment 30 by Greyed

@HappyPrimate, I agree. I am forever a student of Autodidact U. and cases like this make me smile at all the people who said one needs, absolutely needs, to go to college/university to learn critical thinking.

This guy represents the perfect example of something Neal deGrasse Tyson said at Beyond Belief '06. He cited studies that showed the more educated the person the less likely they were to be theists. When it came to the top scientists of the world it was something like 85%. He then said they missed the real story. Why isn't that number 100%?

Fri, 13 Feb 2009 23:34:00 UTC | #324503