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← Majority of Americans Believe Health Care Reform 'Myths'

Majority of Americans Believe Health Care Reform 'Myths' - Comments

NewEnglandBob's Avatar Comment 1 by NewEnglandBob

Republican wackos continue to lie and ruin the US.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:17:00 UTC | #391507

hossein's Avatar Comment 3 by hossein

I send this one because of their use of the word "belief," which points to a similarity between this phenomenon and belief in fantastical creatures like gods. Look how many times the article talks about right wing americans "believing" in "myths."


Jon stewart's daily show also mentions the exact same thing once, and his saying was funny! Does anybody remember which episode and knows the link to watch.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:18:00 UTC | #391510

Bernard Hurley's Avatar Comment 2 by Bernard Hurley

I'm not sure that it matters that people have beliefs. The problems start when "I believe X" is taken as an argument in favour of X rahter than a statement about one's mental state.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:18:00 UTC | #391509

jonsmizzle's Avatar Comment 4 by jonsmizzle

Well, lets be fair here people. Most of these "myths" are really guesses about what will happen to a very large, dynamic economic system with the introduction of a public health care option. I don't see any reason to accept the Whitehouse's monopoly on right answers for these. You know, the "whitehouse" has been wrong about things before. Is it really so hard to believe that wait times might go up, that private premiums might increase, or that the government might become more directly involved in health care in the future? Are these really unreasonable, is this right-wing wackalooery?

There are reasonable Americans on the right-side of the political spectrum. Not EVERYONE who thinks the government shouldn't be involved in healthcare goes to a chiropractor or is afraid of giving their kids autism with a vaccination shot.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:36:00 UTC | #391518

bnightm's Avatar Comment 5 by bnightm

Here's an opinion that will appear trolling but isn't meant to be:
Woah... What a shallow attempt at relating this article to atheism, coming out and "clear-thinking".
It's like every other article posted here is more concerned about addressing right wing ideology than theology or the absence thereof. I'm sure there will be people claiming socialism is a more "rational" choice, only to miss the point entirely.

RD.net - Come for the blasphemy, stay for the Keynesian economics?

Edit: I miss the avatars.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:39:00 UTC | #391521

Imroy's Avatar Comment 6 by Imroy

For more myths from the crazy christian right, see this FSTDT quote. The fundies seem to think that Obama's plan will result in government involvement in medical practice (socialism!), tax-payer funded abortions (murder!), forced euthanasia (nazis!) for older patients when it becomes too expensive to keep them alive, and that care will cost more but be worse, just like Faux News and those discredited ads keep telling them.

Meanwhile, those of us in more civilised countries are enjoying our universal healthcare (although not perfect), and wonder what all the fuss is about.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:45:00 UTC | #391524

Sievers's Avatar Comment 7 by Sievers

Aren't a lot of the myths going around downright lies about the health Services in Britain and elsewhere?

And some of the comments under the article make depressing reading!

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:47:00 UTC | #391527

godless_hoor's Avatar Comment 8 by godless_hoor

I've seen the occasional excerpt from television news shows (mainly Fox, it has to be said) where they're describing what life will be like with universal health care, and citing the UK's NHS as an example.

The picture they paint is unrecognisable to what people in the UK are familiar with. One correspondent said in the UK you can't choose your own GP or surgeon, that medicine was not a respected career, that doctors were poorly paid, and if something goes wrong you have no comeback as the government is in complete control.

This was blatant fucking lies, every single word of it. There is no other way of putting it.

But if this is said often enough by vested interests, some people are undoubtedly going to believe it.

Some people in the US believe in a hands off style of government, and there is a lot to be said for that as the country is so successful economically. If that is the motivation for being against these reforms then that is harder to argue with. But it would be a shame if people were against the reforms because of the nasty myths about death panels etc that are muddying the waters of the debate.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:49:00 UTC | #391528

tieInterceptor's Avatar Comment 9 by tieInterceptor

50% Americans answer "yes" when asked in a poll if they believe if ghosts are real...

so I'm not surprised.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:09:00 UTC | #391538

friendlypig's Avatar Comment 10 by friendlypig

I saw a great video a few days ago, can't remember where, and the correlation between those who believe these myths, Republican voters and those whose primary source of information was Fox News was staggering.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:12:00 UTC | #391540

liberalartist's Avatar Comment 11 by liberalartist

What has amazed me is seeing a lot of poor people stand up to rant and rave about government healthcare when they have none, or they are on medicare already. Its one thing to debate the economic points of various plans, but to claim the government will kill off your grandmother when she gets too old is just ridiculous.

I think some of this anger is really about losing the last election and about the economy. But I also think that once the Republican party became the "party-of-god" dogmatism spread like a disease.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:19:00 UTC | #391544

bluesky's Avatar Comment 12 by bluesky

I have lived for periods of time in the UK, France and the US. In my experience and opinion, France has the best of the three, the UK a fairly close second, but the US 'health care industry' totally shocked me.

I was one of the lucky ones - I had comprehensive care paid for by my employer while I was in the US. But what I found frightening was how the richest country in the world allows people to die because they can't afford the right sort of insurance.

Some of the utter bilge and downright lies being peddled about the NHS and other civilised forms of health care are shocking UNTIL you remember how powerful the vested interests are in the US.

If the NHS is a 'communist' system - then I'm happy to be a communist!!

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:36:00 UTC | #391546

DamnDirtyApe's Avatar Comment 13 by DamnDirtyApe

Did you folks see Jon Stewart's interview with Betsy McCaughey regarding the plan?

I think Jon was right on the money. I heard her concerns but I just didn't see her present any evidence for them aside from maybe that doctor's letter at the end of the interview.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:37:00 UTC | #391548

Steve Zara's Avatar Comment 14 by Steve Zara

Comment #409301 by friendlypig

This was probably it:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#32469231

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:43:00 UTC | #391550

markg's Avatar Comment 15 by markg

comment removed - same as above post

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:51:00 UTC | #391554

Ivan The Not So Bad's Avatar Comment 16 by Ivan The Not So Bad

A short film about birth on the NHS:

http://tinyurl.com/a6jhfd

Ping!

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:56:00 UTC | #391556

DamnDirtyApe's Avatar Comment 17 by DamnDirtyApe

14. Comment #409311 by Steve Zara on August 25, 2009 at 5:43 pm

...Excellent point by Maher. People appeared to forget that the platform Obama won the election on was essentially 'prepare to do some work'. Dammit, that's what his whole 'winter of discontent' speech with the whole 'braving icy currents' was about. It wasn't just principled, it was a realistic campaign, that's why he deserved to win it.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:59:00 UTC | #391558

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 18 by mordacious1

I remember a poll being taken during the HillaryCare debate, years ago. The first question was: Do you listen to Rush Limbaugh? Next was: Do you think you know the facts about the healthcare debate? This was followed by some actual questions about the issues on healthcare.

Of the Limbaugh listeners most stated they knew the facts enough to make an informed decision. The non-listeners felt they didn't. When it came down to answering the healthcare questions, the Limbaugh listeners failed miserably, the non-listeners did quite well.

Just goes to show.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 17:14:00 UTC | #391565

zengardener's Avatar Comment 19 by zengardener

I don't know how the bill is supposed to work, or how it will work.

I seriously doubt that health care can cost more and be rationed.

On average, Americans pay so much more per capita and the results are an inferior set of health statistics.

I just don't trust the fear mongers. I've seen their work before.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 17:28:00 UTC | #391571

notsobad's Avatar Comment 20 by notsobad

Well these myths may be at least partially true if the system will be like the crap we have in Ireland.

No surprise that the two most religious Western countries also have the worst health care systems in general.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 17:39:00 UTC | #391574

friendlypig's Avatar Comment 21 by friendlypig

14. Comment #409311 by Steve Zara on August 25, 2009 at 5:43 pm

Thanks Steve that was it.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 17:55:00 UTC | #391584

markg's Avatar Comment 22 by markg

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:00:00 UTC | #391586

Colwyn Abernathy's Avatar Comment 23 by Colwyn Abernathy

Here's the links to Jon's interview of Betsy:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-august-20-2009/betsy-mccaughey-pt--1

"Wait a minute! This is a Nancy comic!"

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-august-20-2009/betsy-mccaughey-pt--2

The Extended versions:

Part 1

Part 2

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:42:00 UTC | #391592

TIKI AL's Avatar Comment 24 by TIKI AL

Wal, it's a gosh durn good thing Stephen Hawking t'wrnt born in the UK and killed by a gubermint death panal fer sickuns.


"Stephen Hawking: Yes to NHS

After his name surfaced in one of the most uninformed editorials ever—Investor’s Business Daily claimed that British citizen and Cambridge professor Stephen Hawking “wouldn’t have a chance in the U.K.” as a way of suggesting that President Obama’s health-care reform would kill “this brilliant man”—the world’s smartest man has weighed in. He endorsed the health-care system that, according to IBD, should have by now killed him. “I wouldn't be alive today if it weren't for the NHS,” Hawking tells Talking Points Memo. “I have received a large amount of high quality treatment without which I would not have survived.”

Nice "reporting" by Investor's Business Daily.
What else are they fabricating?

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:31:00 UTC | #391600

connorculleton's Avatar Comment 25 by connorculleton

This is pretty basic and I am surprised more people don't understand.

A Public healthcare system will almost certainly increase the cost of healthcare in the US... Not in what you pay for the healthcare but what you pay in taxes and inflation. Just look at how much NHS loses every year. This will ultimately be paid in taxes or by the printing of money (which is happening) and inflation (which costs poor people more than the rich).

Govt provided services nearly always cost more net (due to lack of competition and market forces) if you can afford to pay for it, like the Scandinavian countries, then fine. The US is in the hole for 11 Trillion dollars. They CANNOT afford it.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:38:00 UTC | #391601

Peacebeuponme's Avatar Comment 26 by Peacebeuponme

connorculleton

Except that healthcare costs way more per head in the US than it does in the UK. The route the money takes from your wallet to the doctors is different for sure.

Oh, and the NHS doesn't really "lose" anything does it? All it has is costs, which go on healthcare.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:49:00 UTC | #391605

TIKI AL's Avatar Comment 27 by TIKI AL

I was in a hospital around Christmas in Tempe Az for 2.5 days for an upper respiratory infection. The bill was $16,656.

The US has contributed to the defense of other countries for over 50 years that no longer need it.
Bring all the troops home from everywhere except strategic bases, and end the archaic and harmful empire.

The elimination of troops from Iraq, Afghanistan, Germany, Japan, and South Korea alone (and all connected corporate contractors) would pay for health care.

Use stealthy and deadly hit squads to wipe out Alcaeda wherever they are, not invasions.

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:19:00 UTC | #391613

exmike's Avatar Comment 28 by exmike

...

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:45:00 UTC | #391619

Nunbeliever's Avatar Comment 29 by Nunbeliever

I guess many people here are americans and therefore probably does not have any experience of public health care... Sometimes I get the feeling that many americans believe they are pioneers at the final fronteer. Just to mention most of the rest of the civilized world have some sort of public health care and it works just fine. It is really a shame how the USA in this respect more resembles a development country. I really hope the americans would be ready to enter the 21th century regarding health care. But who knows...

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:58:00 UTC | #391621

notsobad's Avatar Comment 30 by notsobad

connorculleton

This is pretty basic and I am surprised more people don't understand.

A Public healthcare system will almost certainly increase the cost of healthcare in the US

http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/publications/news/news-now/clinical-care-research/20071024us-europeanhealth.html

"The study in the Oct. 2 Health Affairs noted that per-capita health care spending in the United States in 2004 was $6,037. That same year, per-capita health care spending was lower in each of the 10 European countries studied, including Austria, France and Italy. At $4,045, Switzerland had the highest per-capita health spending of the European countries studied, but still spent only two-thirds as much as the United States."

Tue, 25 Aug 2009 21:20:00 UTC | #391624