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The great happy Vatican death spiral - Comments

mrjohnno's Avatar Comment 1 by mrjohnno

When you have more than enough, having even more is worthless.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 12:59:00 UTC | #459279

LuchinG's Avatar Comment 2 by LuchinG

¿What if they close down the Roman Catholic Church, and it's replaced with american-style evangelists?

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 13:16:00 UTC | #459285

Fouad Boussetta's Avatar Comment 3 by Fouad Boussetta

Nice article.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 13:20:00 UTC | #459288

Pete.K's Avatar Comment 4 by Pete.K

What if they close down the Roman Catholic Church, and it's replaced with american-style evangelists?


Quite honestly, I can't see that happening, for a start the RCC was there at the birth of christianity, and it had death, torture, threats and extortion at it's disposal to coerce the weak minded and uneducated into obeying it's every word. Education has been the antidote to religion, from the translation of the bible, through education for all, and now to the internet that allows the truth to spread faster and wider than ever before.

Once the lumbering monolith, that is the RCC, has been brought to it's knees, we can then bring the Fred Phelps of this world to justice for polluting the minds of children and weak minds.

I dream of a day when religious indoctrination cannot, by law, be attempted until mental maturity, around 18 years old I would suggest, just as is applicable for alcohol consumption (In the UK.).

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 13:49:00 UTC | #459297

Wadsworth's Avatar Comment 5 by Wadsworth

"What if they close down the Roman Catholic Church, and it's replaced with american-style evangelists?"

They will be the next to fall.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:03:00 UTC | #459303

DeusExNihilum's Avatar Comment 6 by DeusExNihilum

Goddamn someone remind me NOT to read the comments on articles like this, the same thing always happens; Brilliant article followed by apologists and stuck-up-catholics arrogantly claiming how untouchable the church is.

It's depressing.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:20:00 UTC | #459309

huzonfurst's Avatar Comment 7 by huzonfurst

Agree, Deus: the cowardly must always caution against any real change.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:31:00 UTC | #459317

LuchinG's Avatar Comment 8 by LuchinG

"Goddamn someone remind me NOT to read the comments on my comments, the same thing always happens; simple question followed by extremists and ex-evangelists arrogantly claiming how untouchable their missión is."

That was to easy.
When I hear an argument, I'll answer it.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:33:00 UTC | #459320

rod-the-farmer's Avatar Comment 9 by rod-the-farmer

Re Pete.K


I dream of a day when religious indoctrination cannot, by law, be attempted until mental maturity, around 18 years old I would suggest, just as is applicable for alcohol consumption (In the UK.).

Hear hear.....all those in favour raise their hands.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 14:34:00 UTC | #459321

Tom Wood's Avatar Comment 10 by Tom Wood

Arrest the pope in effigy wherever he goes and parade his likeness around in a cage. Show him behind bars and people will accept the idea of it more easily over time.

http://minigiggles.com/2010/04/14/pope-on-the-ropes/

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 15:04:00 UTC | #459346

huzonfurst's Avatar Comment 11 by huzonfurst

#8, and your point is?

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 15:06:00 UTC | #459349

Diacanu's Avatar Comment 12 by Diacanu

LuchinG-


What if they close down the Roman Catholic Church, and it's replaced with american-style evangelists?


What if the Fantastic Four all had the same powers?

What if Peter Parker had been bitten by a radioactive dung beetle?

What if humanity grew a fucking pair when it came to facing death?

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 15:16:00 UTC | #459357

DeusExNihilum's Avatar Comment 13 by DeusExNihilum

@ LuchinG

I'm sorry you've completely lost me. I wasn't referring to the comments on THIS page (At RD.net) I was referring to the comments on the article from the source site (sfgate.com). I certainly didn't aim my frustration or comment at you, as I found your hypothetical "What if" rather pointless and inane.

I certainly hope you're not flattering yourself by assuming I paid the blindest bit of attention to you.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:13:00 UTC | #459390

MAJORPAIN's Avatar Comment 14 by MAJORPAIN

Deus, I knew exactly who you were talking about because I too, much to my regret, began reading the comments. First, I'm disappointed because this is San Francisco so I expected more. Second, I started to become nauseous and had to stop reading. It was like a bunch of little children had gotten on there and started chanting "we can't hear you, lalalalala" with their fingers in their ears.

After reading stuff like that I highly doubt if the RCC will ever be brought down. They've got indoctrination on their side. It's hard to get people that have been hardwired from birth to see the truth. The fact that it happens so seldom is great evidence of this.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:23:00 UTC | #459391

Dr. Strangegod's Avatar Comment 15 by Dr. Strangegod

Deus - Don't read the comments, dude. You and I had this discussion the other day. I know how hard it is. My mouse just scrolls on down! But it's really not worth it.

And what a wonderful title for an article. Shit, that should be a song... I'll work on it.

And I second Diacanu's third question. Yeesh.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:37:00 UTC | #459397

LuchinG's Avatar Comment 16 by LuchinG

My point is that the clergy is not the head of a snake, you dont kill the head and the body will die. If we disparage the clergy, the catholics will open the door to the competition. If this discution were about how to throw down the Berlin wall, i would be asking: Then, ¿how do we integrate the east germans without causing an economic collapse?

I live in a 95% catholic country with and Opus Dei Cardinal. Its awful, but it's not Jesus Camp. Attack them and people will go to the competition. So my question is: ¿How do we attack the RCC without creating an evangelist wave?

MAYBE the solution is this: 1) Not to try to arrest the pope, but to sue the RCC to make them abandon their monarquist regime, which is the especifical cause of their getting away with this crimes. 2) Never attack a religión by separated, but religións and other beliefs at the same time, allways point out their main predujice: that they blind us from the truth. (The other predujices are derived from this one).

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:46:00 UTC | #459401

DeusExNihilum's Avatar Comment 17 by DeusExNihilum

@Lucas "Deus - Don't read the comments, dude. You and I had this discussion the other day. I know how hard it is. My mouse just scrolls on down!"

It's like my scrolling-finger hates me! I tell it "NO" but it goes "TOO BAD"

xD lol

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:47:00 UTC | #459402

prettygoodformonkeys's Avatar Comment 18 by prettygoodformonkeys

I like his re-interpretation of the Apocalypse. When the Church falls, it only seems like an apocalypse if you're inside it.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 17:03:00 UTC | #459411

Stonyground's Avatar Comment 19 by Stonyground

I have expressed elsewhere that I am amazed that there has not been some kind of grass root revolt from the ordinary Catholics. Having also read some of the comments below this article I now have an explanation, these people are just terminally stupid.

The Catholic Church does charity work, is 2,000 years old and Mark Morford is a crap journalist.

Oh well, why didn't you say before, there was me thinking that the RCC was institutionally evil and rotten to the core when all the time it has been totally blameless and the Pope is a really great guy.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 17:36:00 UTC | #459421

Dr. Strangegod's Avatar Comment 20 by Dr. Strangegod

Stonyground - It's a matter of belief. I know that sounds obvious, but sometimes it's hard for nonbelievers to wrap their head around what belief actually entails. My grandfather is a wonderful, sweet old man. He is also a Catholic. Although I haven't mentioned it, I know what his response to all this must be: he simply doesn't believe it. In his mind the Pope and the Vatican are holy and couldn't possibly be doing evil things. No amount of evidence will change his mind. He is committed to belief instead of rational thought. It shouldn't be too surprising that those whose minds are malleable enough to believe in the first place can easily believe or disbelieve anything they choose for any reason. I could show my grandfather the actual letter with Ratz's signature pardoning pedophiles, and he would not waver. He would assume there was good reason. He believes in the divine authority of the Church. That's it.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 17:56:00 UTC | #459430

Pilot22A's Avatar Comment 21 by Pilot22A

Well, the "True Believers" would just say that this is the Lard's way of teaching a lesson; to the child, character, and to the priest; how hard it is to overcome the temptations of the flesh.

This problem won't go away until all religions are gone.

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 18:32:00 UTC | #459450

jcob82's Avatar Comment 22 by jcob82

I will drink to the day the RCC falls. As to American evangelicals becoming more dominant I would like to point out a lawsuit about child rape and the Boy Scouts which the Mormons helped keep quiet. The Boy Scouts were found guilty and the Mormons plea bargained. Here is a link to the Minneapolis Star Tribune

http://www.startribune.com/nation/90758019.html

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 18:37:00 UTC | #459454

shaunfletcher's Avatar Comment 23 by shaunfletcher

"I have expressed elsewhere that I am amazed that there has not been some kind of grass root revolt from the ordinary Catholics."

Lots of people (even phil plait who should know better by now) seem to cling to this.. But the body of the faithful simply cannot do this. They are incapable, their lives revolve around the idea of the church as holy and of priests as gods shepherds. For most of them its just too late to see the truth.

The only way they could do it from the inside is for a 'heretic prophet' character to arise inside the church. Someone of at least bishop level who would stand up and declare the whole shebang of the heirarchy to be tainted and heretical and start a turf war. And that hasnt shown any sign of happening, perhaps because of the effectiveness of the inquisition under roland ratz of shutting down any 'impurity'

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 20:10:00 UTC | #459505

Brian English's Avatar Comment 24 by Brian English

You could call it one of the greatest ironies of man: Only when our supposedly "holy" dogmas, institutions and leaders fail, can the human soul ever truly be free.



Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest

Wed, 14 Apr 2010 23:37:00 UTC | #459580

Alyson Miers's Avatar Comment 25 by Alyson Miers

grand ritual down by the beach, a fantastic ceremony featuring copious amounts of fire and cake, dancing and vodka, Shakti icons and free condoms for all?


Aww, fuck it. Why should we wait around for the downfall of any church for a party like that? Let's do it now and plaster the photos all over the walls of the local woo-houses!

Fire and cake can't wait!

http://alysonmiers.wordpress.com/

Thu, 15 Apr 2010 01:03:00 UTC | #459595

Bonzai's Avatar Comment 26 by Bonzai

Brian English (The fat man with the turban)

Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest


This is too bloody and violent for my taste. I will switch channel.

Thu, 15 Apr 2010 03:43:00 UTC | #459632

Diacanu's Avatar Comment 27 by Diacanu

LuchinG-


...you dont kill the head and the body will die.


Actually, it does, and there's precedence.

When America de-deified the Japanese emperor after WWII, that little religion died just fine.

Thu, 15 Apr 2010 15:53:00 UTC | #459849

InYourFaceNewYorker's Avatar Comment 28 by InYourFaceNewYorker

This video is a perfect example of what goes on in the Catholic Church ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InFLnzeQjWw

Fri, 16 Apr 2010 02:45:00 UTC | #460040

Quine's Avatar Comment 29 by Quine

WOW! This open letter from one of Ratzinger's fellow theologians is a MUST READ:

Church in worst credibility crisis since Reformation, theologian tells bishops
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/0416/1224268443283.html

Fri, 16 Apr 2010 03:27:00 UTC | #460053

mordacious1's Avatar Comment 30 by mordacious1

Quine

Yes, good read. Hans Kueng has been a thorn in the RCC's side for some time now. He's written a lot about papal infallibility...thinks it's BS. He's trying to bring the church into the 21st Century, but of course Ratz is living in the 13th or the 4th, so good luck with that.

Fri, 16 Apr 2010 04:54:00 UTC | #460073