This site is not maintained. Click here for the new website of Richard Dawkins.

← Will the last person to leave the Church of England please turn out the lights

Will the last person to leave the Church of England please turn out the lights - Comments

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 1 by Cartomancer

If they really want to revitalise their corporation then they should ditch the duff products (theism, rituals, moral pontificating, homophobia) and focus more on the things people really want from them - summer fetes, home-made jam, weak tea and architectural heritage.

They could officially rebrand themselves as the British Tea, Jam and Gothic Arch Appreciation Society. Maybe even have open-air festivals to appeal to the youth - Spandrelfest '012, The Canterbury Extreme Jam and Ultimate Biscuits Party, Summer Finials Roadshow, Flapjackpocalypse...

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:00:37 UTC | #617418

strangebrew's Avatar Comment 2 by strangebrew

They are dead but just don't know it yet.

They strongly suspect methinks hence the jostling and barracking in Synod...they are seeing where the pieces land to coalesce around yet another reincarnation of a faith only this time removed from the vagaries of establishment. And the greatest agitators are the bunnies that hold creationism as their tipple. They see an opportunity to get their preferred version center and front to a dogma they can control.

The A of C has a problem, of his closest advisors at least two very senior Bishop's profess Genesis as literal truth, he is not surrounded by friends. And they have no agenda to support Rowan beyond the menial tasks of ecclesiastical jiggery pokery. They have other fish to fry, and are quite willing to see Rowan get torn limb from limb in Synod...and bless his cotton socks he has no idea the sharks are circling. He is expendable in the scheme of things but makes a handy lightening conductor at the moment.

Five years will see further schism, absolutely no doubt. The loonies will indeed run the asylum.

And the RCC's might be oblivious to the fact but religious rot is spreading, and they are as vulnerable as well, Benny is not that popular despite the lies to the contrary, there lies yet another seething cauldron of hysterical genuflecting.

Benny was the desperate pragmatic hope to halt the decline of mother church and his conservative agenda was seen as a bulwark against creeping liberalization and secular ascendancy in the West, it is a forlorn hope, it is patently not working and the pedophile scandals will be his ultimate undoing methinks!

The rot from both delusions is stinking, but that is to be welcomed, problem being that wounded critters crawling off to die often take as many lives with them as possible. They become rabid and completely unpredictable in their death throes, this will not be a pleasure more of a view of the utter ugly and a personification of evil incarnate.

The debacle of the two xian cults slowly disintegrating and rotting in their own swill will not be lost on Muslim fanatics, there lies the opportunity, will they take it I wonder...? The benefit of appealing to a Western government as a stable and virtuous religion might render unto Mohammad rewards beyond financial. But even they have their internal spats...like of the murderous kind...so a typical religion.

There will always be brain dead thumb suckers that buy into codswollop...that is a given...there will always be more then a few scamming the brain dead...that is a given.

What is not a given is how long the status quo will continue, that the tide has turned and is still turning is quite obvious, when it drains away what is left will be the few actually capable of picking up the pieces....because the presently afflicted will not have a clue where to begin.

But all it requires is one David Koresh or Jim Jones clone and all bets are off...that is the real danger.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:14:28 UTC | #617420

irate_atheist's Avatar Comment 3 by irate_atheist

Comment 1 by Cartomancer -

Love it mate, love it.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:20:43 UTC | #617423

Logicel's Avatar Comment 4 by Logicel

Really appreciated your comment, Strangbrew.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:24:15 UTC | #617424

Roger J. Stanyard's Avatar Comment 5 by Roger J. Stanyard

I wouldn't gloat about thee decline in the Church of England. Like it or not, as religious belief declines in the UK, Christianity is increasingly falling into the hands of fundamentalists 9including creationists). They are a rising group in the Anglican Church, increasingly controlling its finances (and therefore the church itself).The big member churches subsidise the smaller ones and the evangelicals have some of the biggest congregations.

I hold the view that the Church of England has had the unwritten job over the last 350 years of protecting England from religious extremism. That is coming to an end' leaving to door open to the extremists. I seea frightening future of religion in Britain divided into two camps - fundamentalist evangelicals and Muslim extremists. Given that the Anglican church controls huge swaths of state funded education, we live in worrying times.

I've just done some work on what has happened at St Peter's CofE school in Exeter. There's not even been apology coming from the school or its board of governors.

I've come to the conclusion that the Anglican church will have to be de-established and its role in state education stopped - solely be cause the church is falling into the hands of extremists. That makes nonsense of current government policies.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:29:26 UTC | #617426

Ode2Hitch's Avatar Comment 6 by Ode2Hitch

For the most accurate summary of the CofE (IMHO) allow me to refer you to one of the best comic creations of our time: Sir Humphrey Appleby:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBtDIVfhh8k

Perfect!

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:13:14 UTC | #617443

Beethoven's Avatar Comment 7 by Beethoven

I kind of feel pity for the CofE. They are quite harmless compared to Islam or other types of Christianity. I would like to see Evangelicals lose their flock to the CofE. It would be a shift from fanaticism towards reasonableness. Why is it that the least extreme of the churches is the least successful on the market for religions ?

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:24:58 UTC | #617449

zeerust2000's Avatar Comment 8 by zeerust2000

Comment 7 by Beethoven

Why is it that the least extreme of the churches is the least successful on the market for religions ?>

Because as secularism grows stronger, the more virulent and extreme forms of religion attract more followers. It is possibly a good sign in some ways......like washing up the dishes and having only the most stubborn stains remaining.

(By the way Beethoven, as I read your post I was listening the the C# minor Quartet Op 131. More than coincidence? No, but great music anyway.)

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:36:50 UTC | #617456

AUS ATHEIST's Avatar Comment 9 by AUS ATHEIST

one less religion to laugh at and ridicule. such a shame.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:00:42 UTC | #617507

Vorlund's Avatar Comment 10 by Vorlund

Comment 7 by Beethoven :

I kind of feel pity for the CofE. They are quite harmless compared to Islam or other types of Christianity. I would like to see Evangelicals lose their flock to the CofE. It would be a shift from fanaticism towards reasonableness. Why is it that the least extreme of the churches is the least successful on the market for religions ?

For one, they exert less influence over their followers. Catholicism has always had a strong grip due to the confessional, rabid proselytising in schools, scaremongering the mindless who buy into their bullshit stories, Islam is even worse but on the other hand Cof E, as Cartomancer puts it is more of a British Tea, Jam and Gothic Arch Appreciation Society which is about as likely to put the fear of god into anyone as a victoria sponge.

On a serious note their education agenda being taken over by the hard liners isn't a nice thought.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:29:12 UTC | #617519

Vorlund's Avatar Comment 11 by Vorlund

Comment 5 by Roger J. Stanyard :

I've just done some work on what has happened at St Peter's CofE school in Exeter. There's not even been apology coming from the school or its board of governors.

Fucking Hell! I've just seen their 'vision statement'.

Take a look at this and weep:-

http://frogserver.st-peters-exeter.devon.sch.uk/index.phtml?d=79041

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:33:54 UTC | #617520

ajs261's Avatar Comment 12 by ajs261

If religious organisations were removed from all schools, I wouldn't really be that critical of the Anglican Church.

But the principle that religious indoctrination is to be kept out of schools MUST be enforced. Or this country is walking into a disaster...

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:51:57 UTC | #617526

Roger J. Stanyard's Avatar Comment 13 by Roger J. Stanyard

Comment 7 by Beethoven :

I kind of feel pity for the CofE. They are quite harmless compared to Islam or other types of Christianity. I would like to see Evangelicals lose their flock to the CofE.

I wouldn't - the problem with extremism in the Church of England is that it already has a lot of its own evangelicals, a good swath of which are increasingly fundamentalist. More evangelicals coming in from other denominations will just increase the problem of fundamentalism. Two of the four evangelical organisations within the CofE are creationist - The Christian Institute and Reform.

As I have suggested, within a generation the Church of England will be an extremist fundamentalist organisation dominated by Biblical literalists and creationists. It's exactly what has happened to America's largest Protestant denomination, the Southern Baptist Convention and is happening right now to the Presbyterian Church in Ireland.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 16:15:05 UTC | #617532

Emmeline's Avatar Comment 14 by Emmeline

Comment 5 by Roger J. Stanyard :

I've just done some work on what has happened at St Peter's CofE school in Exeter. There's not even been apology coming from the school or its board of governors.

I've been reading your comments on the newspaper website - you're doing a brilliant job there and well done for giving it so much time. I feel very sympathetic towards the Anglican parents who are angry about this, particularly the response to the mother by the school.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 17:28:10 UTC | #617551

Neodarwinian's Avatar Comment 15 by Neodarwinian

History does move on and I can not see any of the " needs " listed here, such as birth, death, marriage, being anything I need from any church. Bye Bye C of E.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 19:01:14 UTC | #617586

Roger J. Stanyard's Avatar Comment 16 by Roger J. Stanyard

Comment 14 by /Jan :

Comment 5 by Roger J. Stanyard :

I've just done some work on what has happened at St Peter's CofE school in Exeter. There's not even been apology coming from the school or its board of governors.

I've been reading your comments on the newspaper website - you're doing a brilliant job there and well done for giving it so much time. I feel very sympathetic towards the Anglican parents who are angry about this, particularly the response to the mother by the school.

Thanks Jan - what you see there is just the tip of the iceberg. I must admit I do respect Laura tremendously. I've spoken to her a length.

What's happening in Exeter appears to be an attempt by the fundamentalists to near take it over - taking control of youth groups in and out of schools, getting into RE lessons, getting their people appointed to positions of influence and so on. They've even got a college there to train up their organisers through 2-year courses.

Wed, 20 Apr 2011 19:50:44 UTC | #617609

Lucid Lucy's Avatar Comment 17 by Lucid Lucy

You can see the temptation. In a multi-cultural Britain, why not a head of state that represents all religions?

Oh, I would love this so much. Then you would hear all the Christians heralding the end of the world. (You know, the unified religion in Apocalypse and all that rubbish)

Thu, 21 Apr 2011 03:47:32 UTC | #617733

sunbeamforjeebus's Avatar Comment 18 by sunbeamforjeebus

Does anyone recall before the General Election Nick Clegg stated that if he were elected he would reform the House of lords.He would make it an all-elected house,which would do away with the Bishops.Now that his is in power, we learn the he is indeed intending to reform the house,but it will only be 80% elected so the bishops remain! Not only that,but he is considering appointing the Chief Rabbi and an Imam also.Presumably, given that Jedi-ism was at the last census the 4th most popular religion here ,we can also look forward to Quai-Gon-Jin or even Master Yoda taking ermine? Apart from the U.K. there is only one other country in the world where clerics write the laws of the land---- The Islamic Republic of Iran.Were in good company aren't we?

Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:20:16 UTC | #617885

sunbeamforjeebus's Avatar Comment 19 by sunbeamforjeebus

Does anyone recall before the General Election Nick Clegg stated that if he were elected he would reform the House of lords.He would make it an all-elected house,which would do away with the Bishops.Now that he is in power, we learn the he is indeed intending to reform the house,but it will only be 80% elected, so the bishops remain! Not only that,but he is considering appointing the Chief Rabbi and an Imam also.Presumably, given that Jedi-ism was at the last census the 4th most popular religion here ,we can also look forward to Quai-Gon-Jin or even Master Yoda taking ermine? Apart from the U.K. there is only one other country in the world where clerics write the laws of the land---- The Islamic Republic of Iran.Were in good company aren't we?

Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:21:43 UTC | #617887

sunbeamforjeebus's Avatar Comment 20 by sunbeamforjeebus

Does anyone recall before the General Election Nick Clegg stated that if he were elected he would reform the House of lords.He would make it an all-elected house,which would do away with the Bishops.Now that he is in power,we learn the he is indeed intending to reform the house,but it will only be 80% elected, so the bishops remain! Not only that,but he is considering appointing the Chief Rabbi and an Imam also.Presumably, given that Jedi-ism was at the last census the 4th most popular religion here ,we can also look forward to Quai-Gon-Jin or even Master Yoda taking ermine? Apart from the U.K. there is only one other country in the world where clerics write the laws of the land---- The Islamic Republic of Iran.Were in good company aren't we?

Thu, 21 Apr 2011 14:23:14 UTC | #617888

stuhillman's Avatar Comment 21 by stuhillman

The correct link for Sir Humphrey on religion is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBtDIVfhh8k

Fri, 22 Apr 2011 15:02:49 UTC | #618101

Adam Sedgwick's Avatar Comment 22 by Adam Sedgwick

Strangebrew

Who are the two bishops who accept "the literal truth of Genesis "? To my knowledge only Wally Benn of Lewes does, though I have some suspects.

As my name suggests I do not like such people around:)

Sat, 23 Apr 2011 06:42:32 UTC | #618314

sunbeamforjeebus's Avatar Comment 23 by sunbeamforjeebus

Triple entry: Sorry for the 3 repeats above kept getting strange messages from the website which indicated posts had not been accepted.

Sat, 23 Apr 2011 09:56:50 UTC | #618364