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Muslim "Children of a Lesser God?" - Comments

CosmicCheshireCat's Avatar Comment 2 by CosmicCheshireCat

Religion of peace? Pull the other one, campanologists find it fascinating!

When religious types (any!) proclaim their religion to be peaceful or about love, I am reminded of racists who preface a hate-filled diatribe with the classic "I'm not racist, but ..." It's about as believable as when a country labels itself 'Democratic', or a 'People's Republic.' Don't get me started on countries called 'Democratic People's Republic'!

Awful stuff religion. Poisons everything, don't you know.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 21:48:30 UTC | #640603

dazzjazz's Avatar Comment 3 by dazzjazz

What a sickening story. I cannot believe what some people will do for power over others. I hope the wave of revolution charging through the middle east does some good in Syria.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:10:44 UTC | #640612

Munski's Avatar Comment 4 by Munski

The rather brutal thing about that story is how it's no more, no less a snapshot of any faith when it's had the reigns of power or the ability to do to people through not only fear of losing their children, but the brutal way in which it uses children to bolster faith by having a parent 'choose faith over the life of their child'. Removing children from families torturing them during the Inquisitions was a way of getting 'proof' that the parents were guilty of heresy. Even stories of faith provide examples of something that's just as deplorable as these stories, but are held up as pillars of the faith. All in all, if I was Isaac, I'd just as soon my father loved me and take me fishing than pull me up a mountain and try to sacrifice me to the voices in his head. Nothing says 'Happy Father's Day' like a lifetime of therapy or self-medicating after an experience like that.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:12:41 UTC | #640615

TobySaunders's Avatar Comment 5 by TobySaunders

conservative media... no, there is no way I'm reading that... intellectual & ethical progression is actually good, contrary to what conservative philosophy says

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:18:39 UTC | #640617

God fearing Atheist's Avatar Comment 6 by God fearing Atheist

In the phrase "vicious Muslim tyrant" how necessary is the word "Muslim"?

When NATO has finished with Gaddafi, will al-Assad be next? (or will NATO be broke)

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:20:33 UTC | #640619

AtheistEgbert's Avatar Comment 7 by AtheistEgbert

There is a huge problem with this article, it uses the tragedy and horror of the torture of a boy to attack all Muslims, propaganda for Christian conservatism. To say this has not caused outrage in the Arab world is a complete lie.

This killing was not about Islam, but about political tyranny and the rule of force and fear. Let's not confuse this issue with conservative propaganda.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:41:10 UTC | #640628

Drosera's Avatar Comment 8 by Drosera

The awful things that happened to that Syrian boy can hardly be attributed to the fact that the Syrian government consists of Muslims. Such things have happened in all brutal dictatorships, in Catholic South America, Nazi Germany, Stalinist Russia, China, you name it. Put thugs in control, and this is what follows. I bet the 'retired Marine infantry officer who served in the Vietnam war, the 1989 intervention into Panama and Desert Storm' who wrote this trash had no such qualms about the torture taking place under Pinochet's regime.

This article smacks of propaganda, and in my opinion has no place on a website that calls itself a Clear Thinking Oasis. I'm disappointed to see it here.

There is enough ammunition against Islam without having to resort to ultra right wing propaganda.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:44:04 UTC | #640630

0.05's Avatar Comment 9 by 0.05

Maybe true, maybe not. I can't belive, for example, that children would be undeterred in that minefield. I am sure that the majority of muslems have as much love for their children as atheists do.

Sun, 19 Jun 2011 22:53:07 UTC | #640634

aym's Avatar Comment 10 by aym

silly article the Syrian regime is a secular one, it has nothing to do with Islam...

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 01:17:55 UTC | #640640

Austin K's Avatar Comment 11 by Austin K

I find it rather uncomfortable agreeing with conservatives and disagreeing with most liberals when it comes to Islam. I don't understand why so many liberals are blind to the horrors of islam, which itself is a far right mindset. Islam is about as right wing as you can get, why can't our lefties see that?

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 01:20:03 UTC | #640641

The Plc's Avatar Comment 12 by The Plc

Agree with the above posters. This is pretty lame right wing bullshit. Unknowable presumptions ('Obama doesn't understand Muslim leaders'), blanket statements, absurdities, grisly in depth details of the wickedness carried out by the enemy, emotive rhetoric... Yawn.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 01:53:51 UTC | #640650

Alternative Carpark's Avatar Comment 13 by Alternative Carpark

I hope the Arab Spring continues gaining momentum, culminating in the fall of the house of Saud.

Once the dust has settled, which may take a decade or two, it will be interesting to see whether a Middle East no longer under the thumb of oppressive regimes is indeed capable of behaving in a manner befitting 21st century society.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 03:08:05 UTC | #640668

mono_thiest's Avatar Comment 14 by mono_thiest

When i was signing up to this site it was for a very clear reason, I am a believer and many on here are disbelivers so there must be a point where we could discuss and engage each other by meeting half way to see how we could benefit each other (if any on either side).

but then i come across aricles such as this and i can't help thinking "is there really another agenda behind this site" or are those that choose to disbelieve clutching at anything ludicrous enough to written by anyone just to reassure themsleves of their position or just to point the finger at an entire religion

My words are harsh because i really find it hard to believe that the author of this article is so extremely misinformed and absolutely has no knowledge of islam or would write an article about an area of this wolrd where he does not know anything about. Since when did the Syrian goverment have anything to do with islamic law? it is a secular state. Where in the Quran or Hadith do you find the torture or killing of any child permitted? Just by these two facts this article has nothing to stand on or convey but the sheer ignorance of the author. What is even more worrying, where is the "Clear thinking oasis"? what ever happened to critical thinking and reasoning? in stark contrast the posters are just jumping on the bang wagon of what i can only call a 'blatant agenda' and misplaced propaganda.

There are thousands of other websites and media outlets that are already doing a fantastic job already without this nonsense, frankly i think you would gain more respect if you openly declared your animosity rather than cowardly covering it with 'concern for those people' and 'support for them'.

Shame

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 03:28:43 UTC | #640679

rjohn19's Avatar Comment 15 by rjohn19

Lesser god??? If gods were any smaller to me they might frighteningly achieve an infinitessimally small singularity, have a Big Bang and we'd be up to our armpits in gods. Hope I pass on before that occurs.

Semi-seriously, Islam is the youngest of the lunacies and it is simply in the Inquisition phase of its evolution. In another four to five hundred years, I feel certain they'll grow and mellow into the sensible, uncaring but partially nonviolent assholes my Southern Baptist friends and neighbors are today.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 03:42:14 UTC | #640681

skiles1's Avatar Comment 16 by skiles1

Not the sort of narrative I'm used to, but I read it anyway. I was surprised to find that conservatives are still trying to spin the Iraq war into something positive; I find it amusing that they're only doing so amongst themselves at this point, from the relative privacy of websites such as Human Events, as if even they still need convincing of it. The suggestion that the war was somehow justifiable was here covered like a monstrous turd by cheap cat litter. Al-Qaeda's atrocities in Iraq wouldn't have occurred if we hadn't invaded, nor would such atrocities justify a holy war against Islam even if that were not the case. The person who wrote the article is a jackass, but I've come to expect that from those who don't view the economy as a social issue.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 04:04:00 UTC | #640685

Enlightenme..'s Avatar Comment 17 by Enlightenme..

What is this bullshit right-wing demonisation of 1.1 billion people doing here?

Top rated comment on the site:

Altosackbuteer 5 days ago Two Moo-slum women are chatting.

One says to another, "Say, did you hear? Fatima's little son Moo-hammed became a shahid the other day. He blew himself up at an Israeli bus stop!"

The second woman smiles and said, "Same thing with Aisha's 6th son! He too went to Heaven the other day after blowing himself up at a Gaza border crossing!"

Then the first said to the second, "By the way, how is YOUR son Bilal? I haven't seen him around lately."

The second Mooslum women said to the first, "Didn't you hear? He got married!"

The first Mooslum woman's jaw dropped in astonishment. "I didn't hear about that!" she cried. "Why didn't you invite me to his wedding?"

The second Mooslum woman smiled and said, "Oh, it wasn't that kind of wedding. He too blew himself up, just the other day, and now he's in heaven with those 72 virgin-wives of his."

The first Mooslum woman nodded and said, "Boy, it seems like it was just yesterday when I used to hold and cuddle him. He had all those adorable curls in his hair!"

The second Mooslum woman nodded and said, "Yes I know. That's just the way it is with children. One minute, they're so little, and then -- poof! Kids just BLOW UP so fast, don't they?"

15 people liked this.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 04:37:50 UTC | #640690

Ignorant Amos's Avatar Comment 18 by Ignorant Amos

Comment 13 by mono_thiest

but then i come across aricles such as this and i can't help thinking "is there really another agenda behind this site" or are those that choose to disbelieve clutching at anything ludicrous enough to written by anyone just to reassure themsleves of their position or just to point the finger at an entire religion

Many articles are posted on this forum....the sublime to the ridiculous.....they are put up to encourage debate, not necessarily portray the views of the sites owner or the views of the forum members.

My words are harsh because i really find it hard to believe that the author of this article is so extremely misinformed and absolutely has no knowledge of islam or would write an article about an area of this wolrd where he does not know anything about. Since when did the Syrian goverment have anything to do with islamic law? it is a secular state.

If you had read the comments of the dozen or so that have posted a comment, you would see that they largely agree with you.

Where in the Quran or Hadith do you find the torture or killing of any child permitted? Just by these two facts this article has nothing to stand on or convey but the sheer ignorance of the author.

And the comments agree.

What is even more worrying, where is the "Clear thinking oasis"? what ever happened to critical thinking and reasoning? in stark contrast the posters are just jumping on the bang wagon of what i can only call a 'blatant agenda' and misplaced propaganda.

The article content has nothing to do with the expression or mindset of those here, I've read the comments here, I must be reading different ones from yourself, most seem to agree that the author is a tit and misrepresenting the situation.....

Comment 5 by God fearing Atheist In the phrase "vicious Muslim tyrant" how necessary is the word "Muslim"?

Comment 6 by AtheistEgbert There is a huge problem with this article, it uses the tragedy and horror of the torture of a boy to attack all Muslims, propaganda for Christian conservatism. To say this has not caused outrage in the Arab world is a complete lie.

This killing was not about Islam, but about political tyranny and the rule of force and fear. Let's not confuse this issue with conservative propaganda.

Comment 7 by Drosera The awful things that happened to that Syrian boy can hardly be attributed to the fact that the Syrian government consists of Muslims.

Comment 8 by 0.05 Maybe true, maybe not. I can't belive, for example, that children would be undeterred in that minefield. I am sure that the majority of muslems have as much love for their children as atheists do. There are thousands of other websites and media outlets that are already doing a fantastic job already without this nonsense, frankly i think you would gain more respect if you openly declared your animosity rather than cowardly covering it with 'concern for those people' and 'support for them'.

Comment 9 by aym silly article the Syrian regime is a secular one, it has nothing to do with Islam...

Comment 11 by The Plc Agree with the above posters. This is pretty lame right wing bullshit. Unknowable presumptions

Comment 15 by skiles1 The person who wrote the article is a jackass, but I've come to expect that from those who don't view the economy as a social issue.

So the "clear thinking oasis" has encouraged debate which largely agrees with you which makes your remarks somewhat disingenuous....now that is a shame.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 04:46:35 UTC | #640693

zengardener's Avatar Comment 19 by zengardener

Comment 13 by mono_thiest

This article was worded and constructed to incite revulsion, disdain, and hatred in a self righteous, right wing conservative christian readership.

Lieutenant Colonel James Zumwalt is a retired Marine infantry officer who served in the Vietnam war, the 1989 intervention into Panama and Desert Storm. An author, speaker and business executive, he also currently heads a security consulting firm named after his father -- Admiral Zumwalt & Consultants, Inc. He has also been cited in numerous other books and publications for unique insights based on his research on the Vietnam war, North Korea (a country he has visited ten times and about which he is able to share some very telling observations) and Desert Storm.

Hamza is yet another in a long line of Muslim children who, for decades, have served as pawns for Muslim leaders in power—or those trying to gain power.

Or Christian, Jewish, communist, fascist, Leftist, Nationalist, Isolationist,... The list goes on...

Evil old men, using whatever handle they can get on the populous to work their own ends. Yes, Islam is Evil, but it is just another sad story in the long sorrowful tale of humanity. Will we ever be rid of such stupidity? Will the darkness of our origins (our mastery of stealth and guile) allow us to explore the full height of our potential for beauty, love and genius?

sometimes I wonder. I don't think that officer Gold-oak-leaf is helping with articles like this.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 04:57:40 UTC | #640694

Vicktor's Avatar Comment 20 by Vicktor

What about the millions of Muslim children forced to pray 5 times a day? Oh, I forgot. It's okay to scold or beat children for things like that.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:26:02 UTC | #640700

keymaker's Avatar Comment 21 by keymaker

Yes, Syria is a signatory to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, of course, so acts of torture by secret service agents are unlawful by its own standards. The Syrian government would be implicated in international law along with the perpetrators if it authorised such acts... in the same way that, for example, the United States and the Bush and Obama administrations are implicated for acts of torture perpetrated by the CIA on children held at Guantanamo Bay, except that's been on a grander scale.

km

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:37:36 UTC | #640701

Anvil's Avatar Comment 22 by Anvil

This just reads like right wing religious conservative bullshit propaganda from a right wing religious conservative bullshit propagandist - a fucking shame it appeared on this site.

'Children of a Lesser God' - give me strength, Christ's sake. Moron.

Anvil.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:54:27 UTC | #640705

Net's Avatar Comment 23 by Net

if this is true, no, WHETHER it is true or not, and i suspect that it is, it is very distressing. i don't know whether to cry or scream out in anger. can this really be happening, and WHY to the (so-called) moderates not say something about it?

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 06:05:47 UTC | #640707

Stevehill's Avatar Comment 24 by Stevehill

Sorry, but I can't see what any of this has to do with religion.

It's just another unpopular dictator clinging onto power at any price. Shitty, but there's plenty of them, of all faiths and none.

Correction, what it does have to do with religion is the foaming-at-the-mouth, rabid, mad, dangerous American religious right stirring up hatred. They need wars to keep the machine oiled and profitable.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 06:14:39 UTC | #640711

weavehole's Avatar Comment 25 by weavehole

The result of giving a million Marines a million typewriters?

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 06:51:48 UTC | #640716

Stevehill's Avatar Comment 26 by Stevehill

@Net

WHY to the (so-called) moderates not say something about it?

This story is not exactly breaking news (except possibly in the US, where a cat stuck in a tree in Peoria will take precedence over any foreign story): just google on the boy's name.

Here's a blog by an Egyptian girl who say's she'd like to cut off the torturers balls. Not all Muslims are evil, and America (and Nato) can and should be doing far more to encourage the "Arab Spring". The delay in deciding to cease supporting the Mubarak regime in Egypt was shameful, as is continuing tacit support for Bahrein and Syria.

Meanwhile Britain gives a safe haven to Mubarak's henchmen, one of whom has been sentenced to 30 years in jail. We have no extradition treaty with Egypt so we're apparently the top destination for the old regime's criminals.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 07:19:13 UTC | #640722

ev-love's Avatar Comment 27 by ev-love

Of the first twelve comments, at least nine condemned this article as what the Pic calls "pretty lame right wing bullshit", yet in comment 13 "mono-theist" cries shame that it appeared on this site at all!

I'd invite him to rethink, but my guess is he didn't do much thinking in the first place.

ev-love

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 07:27:21 UTC | #640726

mirandaceleste's Avatar Comment 28 by mirandaceleste

Comment 21 by Anvil :

This just reads like right wing religious conservative bullshit propaganda from a right wing religious conservative bullshit propagandist

Yes indeed.

And this, from the article, is pure nonsense:

While extremists foster this culture, the lack of outrage by moderate Muslims makes them just as culpable.

Ugh, no. That argument would be valid if and only if he'd taken out the "just as" and replaced it with something like "...until the moderates speak out against these activities, then they, too, share some of the blame".

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 07:34:16 UTC | #640729

epeeist's Avatar Comment 29 by epeeist

Comment 6 by AtheistEgbert :

There is a huge problem with this article, it uses the tragedy and horror of the torture of a boy to attack all Muslims, propaganda for Christian conservatism.

Yes, the enemy of my enemy is not my friend. Especially when

Human Events gives voice to the great conservative thinkers of our era — including Michelle Malkin, Thomas Sowell, Newt Gingrich, Pat Buchanan, L. Brent Bozzell, John Stossel, Terence Jeffrey, Erick Erickson, David Limbaugh, Oliver North, and many more.

And

Human Events is the periodical in which the peerless Ann Coulter, our legal affair correspondent and key participant in our weekly editorial meetings, proudly considers her editorial "home"

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 07:37:38 UTC | #640731

Jos Gibbons's Avatar Comment 30 by Jos Gibbons

Children of a Lesser God

One need only read the Bible to realise the problem with Islam is not so much having a worse god as taking its god more seriously. When Christians took their Bible that seriously, their behaviour was comparable. Sadly, Islam, a younger religion, has yet to have a renaissance.

Obama continues to believe he can engage in meaningful dialogue with leaders he just does not understand.

One of Obama’s parents was Muslim. He may just know how they tick, mightn’t he?

Muslim children being used/abused

Arguably, one way they are abused is being called Muslim children in the first place, rather than children of Muslim parents.

A 2004 incident at an Israeli checkpoint in the West Bank is most telling about how diverse cultures place different values upon the same life.

But does it? Isn’t this entire article just a bunch of anecdotes? Where is the study showing a statistically significant difference in Muslim and Jewish propensities to behave in certain ways? And how do we know, given the near perfect equivalence in this context of religious, racial, cultural and geographic labels of the people involved, which difference between them causes any behavioural differences we observe?

In devaluing any child’s life, Muslims effectively make them “children of a lesser God.”

Children of lesser parents, surely? Ultimately, no child is a child of any god, as none exist. (Or, if you instead think god X exists, all children are children of X. Whatever. Either way, reality lacks the pluralism of our beliefs about it.)

The Middle East will never know peace as long as the cycle of hatred fostered by Muslim extremists and tolerated by Muslim moderates continues to victimize Muslim children.

Again, children of Muslim parents is what they should be called. But would greater respect of their own children really stop Muslims blowing up everyone else?

Zumwalt is a retired Marine infantry officer who served in the Vietnam war, the 1989 intervention into Panama and Desert Storm. An author, speaker and business executive, he also currently heads a security consulting firm named after his father -- Admiral Zumwalt & Consultants, Inc. He has also been cited in numerous other books and publications for unique insights based on his research on the Vietnam war, North Korea (a country he has visited ten times and about which he is able to share some very telling observations) and Desert Storm.

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 07:43:43 UTC | #640733

Austin K's Avatar Comment 31 by Austin K

Maybe I should clarify that I don't necessarily agree with this writer and other conservatives about why we should be against Islam. They generally see it as a threat to Christianity first, and humanity second. This writer is clearly more interested in propagating his own propaganda than honesty. What nauseates me though, is how many liberals seem to be so set to argue with conservatives, that they don't bother to actually look at the true face of Islam. If more "moderate" Muslims spoke out and started acting like our liberals say they act, I'd be overjoyed, but until then, I find myself uncomfortably in bed with the likes of this Glenn Beckish right wing nut. I'm pretty liberal, Islam is far more conservative than the worst of the Chritian right. Why can't most other liberals see this?

Mon, 20 Jun 2011 08:08:11 UTC | #640738