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Italian sparrow joins family as a new species - Comments

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 1 by aquilacane

we think [the two species] have formed some kind of reproductive barrier to each other," Prof Saetre said

Spanish sparrow's religion doesn't allow that. Italian sparrows are the devil!

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:04:08 UTC | #873145

Aztek's Avatar Comment 2 by Aztek

I'm sure this news will spread like wildfire through the creationist community and make them realize at once that evolution is a fact...NOT!

There has been a few other cases of hybrid animals found over the years. Species which are distinctly different from their two "parent species", but are still able to reproduce. How have these news been met by the creationists? With denial or silence.

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:28:08 UTC | #873165

Veronique's Avatar Comment 3 by Veronique

Yay, I really enjoy things like speciation and this isn't even island speciation. These birds live in the same habitat environment as their distinctly different Spanish neighbours.

Just wonderful to know that evolutionary principles are alive and well in our world. How unusual and how totally unexpected, hahahahaha. (That was a joke!)

I can't say Aztek, but I am not surprised that creationists can't come up with anything that could remotely answer this:-).

At least, this little bird is a real and recognizable animal. I sort of understood that the creationists couldn't quite come to terms with evolving bacteria and viruses. But this!!! You bet this will throw a spanner in their works.

Pleased am I!!

Cheers V

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 16:46:54 UTC | #873177

Obi wan kolobi's Avatar Comment 4 by Obi wan kolobi

Creationist spin- See this species was created by hybridization, not natural selection. Darwin obviously didn't know he was talking about. Game over. God done did it.

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 17:01:28 UTC | #873182

Alan4discussion's Avatar Comment 5 by Alan4discussion

Evolution continues on through the ages. Fertility with the inability to back cross = new species.

Creationists will no doubt claim they are the same "kind" and in their whizz-dumb with their "advanced" barmy-ology classification system, clearly identify them as the "kind".. ... bird! Possibly even the "sub-kind" - "SMALL bird"!

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 17:02:57 UTC | #873183

Geysser's Avatar Comment 6 by Geysser

This can only mean that the Creator still creates!

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 17:06:34 UTC | #873185

Sjoerd Westenborg's Avatar Comment 7 by Sjoerd Westenborg

This is a clear sign of intelligent design! only the Creator could plan this out! what are the odds that two species of sparrows breed and create a viable third species? you should be ashamed of your false pride and your 'research', which is just interference with His plan!!!

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 18:21:26 UTC | #873220

The Darwinian's Avatar Comment 8 by The Darwinian

Maybe this is the guy who lands on my clothesline and shits on my jeans!

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 20:21:23 UTC | #873268

Alan4discussion's Avatar Comment 9 by Alan4discussion

Further to my comment @5, this type of new species is well known in plants:

If an allohex-aploid crosses with a diploid an allo-octaploid could arise in a similar fashion, and so on to higher levels of allopolyploidy. An allopolyploid is often intermediate in appearance between both Parental species and cannot reproduce with either. Hence it may merit the status of a new species. Allopolyploidy has been described as instant evolution. - http://botanydictionary.org/allopolyploidy.html

Many crop plants are believed to have originated in this way. Wheat (Triticum aestivum), for example, is an allohexaploid. It has a chromosome number of 42 and is probably derived from the three species T. monococcum, Aegilops spel-toides, and A. squarrosa, each with 14 chromosomes.

...Also some new garden flowers:-

However if certain of the chromosomes from the two parent species are sufficiently similar (see homoeology) then multivalents may be seen at meiosis. When this occurs the allopolyploids are termed segmental allopolyploids. An example is the allotetraploid Primula kewensis derived from a cross between P. floribunda and P. verticillata.

Tue, 20 Sep 2011 23:37:41 UTC | #873360

DavidMcC's Avatar Comment 10 by DavidMcC

NCBI paper: No genomic mosaicism in a putative hybrid butterfly species

... However, comparison of our data to DNA sequence data for another putative hybrid Heliconius species, Heliconius heurippa, suggests that the H. heurippa genome may be a mosaic.

In other words, some animal speciations are by allopolyploidy, but others by mosaicism. It is not clear which aplies to this sparrow.

Wed, 21 Sep 2011 09:19:28 UTC | #873470

DavidMcC's Avatar Comment 11 by DavidMcC

... Sorry, I should have said "some animal speciations by hybridisation are by ..."

Wed, 21 Sep 2011 12:29:50 UTC | #873529

Agrajag's Avatar Comment 12 by Agrajag

Comment 1 by aquilacane

we think [the two species] have formed some kind of reproductive barrier to each other," Prof Saetre said

Spanish sparrow's religion doesn't allow that. Italian sparrows are the devil!

Yes, and don't they realize that barrier devices increase the transmission of disease, apart from what they do to the morals?
Steve

Wed, 21 Sep 2011 13:47:46 UTC | #873561

Haymaker's Avatar Comment 13 by Haymaker

Italian Sparrow? Spugghi?

Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:23:49 UTC | #916190