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David Cameron says the UK is a Christian country - Comments

snail-12's Avatar Comment 1 by snail-12

What a dreadfully confused chap. Maybe Nick Clegg could show him how silly this is.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:43:58 UTC | #900055

GavinKing666's Avatar Comment 2 by GavinKing666

I am American, just throwing that on the table to start off with, so my opinions on the UK's government are not as important nor as valued as those of the citizens of your nation. This I find to be just as disgraceful as the same types of actions done by American politicians. I was under the impression that UK politicians avoided the faith subject as your would a person with a contagious disease, though I could be wrong.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:45:06 UTC | #900056

Ivan The Not So Bad's Avatar Comment 3 by Ivan The Not So Bad

The truth is here in the latest British Social Attitudes Survey. See section 12.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:46:32 UTC | #900057

Slugsie's Avatar Comment 4 by Slugsie

So Mr Cameron. Will you be retracting that statement when the results of the last national census are revealed and it's shown that all brands of Christianity combined still can't muster a majority?

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:48:17 UTC | #900059

Alan4discussion's Avatar Comment 5 by Alan4discussion

Anything that might win a few votes for his crumbling coalition! His candidate has just lost a by-election, and he has just been left with his welly in his mouth, for using a veto trying to appease his party's "Eurosceptics"!

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:50:05 UTC | #900060

timtalkstoomuch's Avatar Comment 6 by timtalkstoomuch

"live and let live" is often code for "keep it to yourself so I don't have to kick your ass"

Just sayin'....

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:52:29 UTC | #900061

Alan4discussion's Avatar Comment 7 by Alan4discussion

Comment 2 by GavinKing666

You should not confuse intellectuals and scientists with politicians! Politicians will suck up to anybody!

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:52:48 UTC | #900062

Scoundrel's Avatar Comment 8 by Scoundrel

It really depends on what he exactly means by the word "christian". If you rip out the old testement, rip out the letters after the gospels and cross out some of the 'miricles',(most can be written off atleast as generosity or conjurers tricks) atleast the ones without any reasonable explanation then you are left with something that is atleast half-reasonable.

Of course England is Christian in the same Way that America is "Secular", oh and there actually is a state church so technically he has said something that is pretty much true. Anyway Whos to stop us Athiest's from being fans of jesus? I am all for more love in the world.

Just remember that England actually has a state Church which actually has a kind of strange nullifying effect on how much people care for the religion. Mostly it's just weddings, funerals and christenings and the rare hop in for christmas or rememberance sunday...Most people don't care and david Cameron's opinion will not change anyone's mind.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 22:54:18 UTC | #900063

pswarwick's Avatar Comment 9 by pswarwick

No faith has the right to claim ownership of our morals, they were around a long time before Christianity and in any case any reasonable person sensitive to the needs of othesr and a desire to live in harmony with others can work them out for himself. Cameron just wants votes from both camps and is merely underlining the moral poverty of politics.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:06:46 UTC | #900069

HardNosedSkeptic's Avatar Comment 10 by HardNosedSkeptic

The UK is a Christian Country?

I don't think so Mr Cameron. Not anymore it isn’t. This is the Post Christian Secular Era.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:11:46 UTC | #900071

mmurray's Avatar Comment 11 by mmurray

"But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today."

I guess that explains why when you walk down Oxford Street so many people are wearing clothes made of a single material.

Michael

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:15:03 UTC | #900072

RomeStu's Avatar Comment 12 by RomeStu

Time for another letter from Richard I think.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:18:28 UTC | #900073

aquilacane's Avatar Comment 13 by aquilacane

He said "live and let live" had too often become "do what you please".

Yes, and "live and force live" has too often become "do what I say"

I pity the fool who tries to make me obey their religion or even acknowledge it.

How about "live and help live", perhaps it will lead to "do what is right"?

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:21:47 UTC | #900074

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 14 by Cartomancer

But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today

Yes. The struggle of the British people to oppose, downplay, grow out of and overcome the wicked morality of the bible has indeed made Britain the tolerant, secular and morally progressive country it is today. And with further opposition, downplaying, growing out of and overcoming it could be a much nicer place to live tomorrow.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:24:24 UTC | #900075

scotsman2010's Avatar Comment 15 by scotsman2010

DC: "But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today."

Pretty worrying that the British PM believes this.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:25:26 UTC | #900077

Cliff Melick's Avatar Comment 16 by Cliff Melick

As a US citizen, suddenly I feel a lot less lonesome.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:26:54 UTC | #900080

Paula Kirby's Avatar Comment 17 by Paula Kirby

"But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today."

Really, Mr Cameron? That's strange. It seems like only a few weeks ago that you weren't all that impressed with "the values and morals which make Britain what it is today" and you were busy telling us how "broken" British society was:

Cameron said: "In the banking crisis, with MPs' expenses, in the phone-hacking scandal, we have seen some of the worst cases of greed, irresponsibility and entitlement. The restoration of responsibility has to cut right across our society. "Do we have the determination to confront the slow-motion moral collapse that has taken place in parts of our country these past few generations? "Irresponsibility. Selfishness. Behaving as if your choices have no consequences. Children without fathers. Schools without discipline. Reward without effort. "Crime without punishment. Rights without responsibilities. Communities without control. Some of the worst aspects of human nature tolerated, indulged – sometimes even incentivised – by a state and its agencies that in parts have become literally de-moralised.

So which is it? Do our values and morals come from Christianity, or are our values and morals inadequate? And remember: you can't claim both that our morals and values are broken because we're no longer Christian enough and that Britain is still a Christian country with Christian values.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:34:03 UTC | #900082

Neodarwinian's Avatar Comment 18 by Neodarwinian

What's this " we " stuff Dave? From what I am hearing you, Mr. Prime Minister. may be among the last of a dying delusion.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:35:55 UTC | #900083

Cook@Tahiti's Avatar Comment 19 by Cook@Tahiti

Describing himself as a "committed" but only "vaguely practising" Christian, the PM admitted he was "full of doubts" about big theological issues.

Talk about trying to appeal to everyone at the same time. How many speechwriters and script-doctors and spin-meisters did it take to come up that? In America it's known as flip-flopping.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:42:26 UTC | #900086

Cook@Tahiti's Avatar Comment 20 by Cook@Tahiti

Even thought the majority of Britons don't believe, they still "believe in belief" so the calculation-matrix of politicians concludes that you get more votes if you declare moderate belief than if you say you if it's a load of bollocks.

It is strange. We don't believe ourselves, but we prefer and vote for politicians that do believe. Only 7% go to church, but 70-80% vote for either of the two main political parties with religious leaders.

I bet most of the British atheists on this site voted for a mainstream political party (Labour, Conservative) where the leader professes belief.

If you don't like theist politicians, stop voting for them.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:44:25 UTC | #900087

Scoundrel's Avatar Comment 21 by Scoundrel

Comment 15 by sc2010 :

DC: "But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today."

Pretty worrying that the British PM believes this.

Even more worrying is your interpretation. Because it literally is a pick and mix book. Some parts are good, some parts are bad. Perhaps DC is just ignoring all the bad bits and think's that most other people would do too.

Have you actually read [the bible] it? Mind explaining why the whole thing is bad news? People are allowed an opinion, and the freedom to express that opinion. So why is there all this rage about what the PM has said? There is a positive way to interpret this.

SAB

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:46:06 UTC | #900088

DaveDodo007's Avatar Comment 22 by DaveDodo007

The Tories -FTW they will never get my vote ever, Cameron = scumbag!

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:46:41 UTC | #900089

Steve Zara's Avatar Comment 23 by Steve Zara

Describing himself as a "committed" but only "vaguely practising" Christian, the PM admitted he was "full of doubts" about big theological issues.

But he staunchly defended the role of religion in politics and said the Bible in particular was crucial to British values.

Is this is supposed to make some sort of sense? How can anyone honestly defend the role of religion in anything if you doubt its foundations? How can anyone be so inept as to defend the role of religion while openly admitting you doubt its foundations? What the heck does being a "committed" Christian mean if you are only "vaguely practising"?

I can't make any sense at all out of what Cameron is saying.

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:51:22 UTC | #900091

Scoundrel's Avatar Comment 24 by Scoundrel

Why does life have to make any sense?

Fri, 16 Dec 2011 23:58:47 UTC | #900094

Cook@Tahiti's Avatar Comment 25 by Cook@Tahiti

Comment 23 by Steve Zara :

I can't make any sense at all out of what Cameron is saying.

He wants to adamantly declare his firm defence of what he has vague doubts about.

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:00:20 UTC | #900095

Jumped Up Chimpanzee's Avatar Comment 26 by Jumped Up Chimpanzee

Just a politician trying to cover as many bases as possible:

"We're a Christian country; other faiths or none are just as valid."

"We need to end yob culture; hug a hoody."

"We're committed to Europe; protect British interests."

"Britain is broken; we're the best country in the world."

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:07:20 UTC | #900097

robaylesbury's Avatar Comment 27 by robaylesbury

To paraphrase Monty Python;

"Let's not go to Cameron. Its a silly place"

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:22:25 UTC | #900103

AlexP's Avatar Comment 28 by AlexP

Comment 17 by Paula Kirby : And remember: you can't claim both that our morals and values are broken because we're no longer Christian enough and that Britain is still a Christian country with Christian values.

Sadly, he can. After all, unsubstantiated claims and contradictory statements are among the most prominent christian values.

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 00:23:02 UTC | #900104

adey5's Avatar Comment 29 by adey5

Thankfully British politicians don't use The Bible to inform their policies. I think Cameron is trying to curry favour with the faithful, perhaps jumping on a badwagon of some description, but I don't think he really believes it either. It's just a sop to the religious.

But he is correct in saying that Britain is 'officially' a Xtian country, luckily not in practice.

Perhaps someone (an advisor) can point out to him what is written in the bible.

What about reading him the first paragraph of Chapter 2 of The God Delusion, Richard?

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 01:27:44 UTC | #900117

ukvillafan's Avatar Comment 30 by ukvillafan

          [Comment 21](/articles/644263-david-cameron-says-the-uk-is-a-christian-country/comments?page=1#comment_900088) by  [Scoundrel](/profiles/171477)          :


                 > [Comment 15](/articles/644263-david-cameron-says-the-uk-is-a-christian-country/comments?page=1#comment_900077) by   [sc2010](/profiles/163709) :> >   DC: "But what I am saying is that the Bible has helped to give Britain a set of values and morals which make Britain what it is today."> > Pretty worrying that the British PM believes this.> Even more worrying is your interpretation. Because it literally is a pick and mix book. Some parts are good, some parts are bad. Perhaps DC is just ignoring all the bad bits and think's that most other people would do too.Have you actually read [the bible] it? Mind explaining why the whole thing is bad news? People are allowed an opinion, and the freedom to express that opinion. So why is there all this rage about what the PM has said? There is a positive way to interpret this. [SAB](http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/)

No there isn't. Firstly, the UK is not a Christian country except constitutionally - the Queen being the Head of State and the Head of the Church of England. We are not even a practising religious country.

Secondly, the morals of the bible are, to put it generously, 'confused'.

Thirdly, in any event, Christianity is not the basis of even the good parts of our 'moral code' given that concepts such as the 'golden rule' (like it or loathe it) pre-date monotheistic 'Abrahamic' religions by some distance..

So you're talking absolute nonsense.

Sat, 17 Dec 2011 02:13:44 UTC | #900136