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Family Battle Offers Look Inside Lavish TV Ministry - Comments

Neodarwinian's Avatar Comment 1 by Neodarwinian

“Prosperity theology is a false theology, '


Then is loss theology the real thing?

Sun, 06 May 2012 00:05:16 UTC | #940005

gsciacca's Avatar Comment 2 by gsciacca

More proof that Americans are the most gullible people in the world.

Sun, 06 May 2012 00:13:21 UTC | #940011

Mee Peestevone's Avatar Comment 3 by Mee Peestevone

Comment 2 by gsciacca :

More proof that Americans are the most gullible people in the world.

Sun, 06 May 2012 01:01:52 UTC | #940021

Net's Avatar Comment 4 by Net

Comment 2 by gsciacca

More proof that Americans are the most gullible people in the world.gullible people in the world.

It's not just he Americans who are gullible. Here are a couple of links that show the lavishness and luxury of other leaders of religion enjoy. You might like to do some internet searches yourself to see how leaders of most if not all religions live.

Palace of the Anglican Archbishop of Canterbury, England link text

The Pope’s Palace link text

Sun, 06 May 2012 01:05:10 UTC | #940022

Cartomancer's Avatar Comment 5 by Cartomancer

Clearly Hell does not exist. If it did then there would have been no need to build this ghastly abomination in Florida.

Sun, 06 May 2012 01:15:25 UTC | #940024

Border Collie's Avatar Comment 6 by Border Collie

Is that really Jesus?

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:03:19 UTC | #940041

GregGorey's Avatar Comment 7 by GregGorey

Ah, Florida. It is a state that resembles metro New York in certain parts and the backwoods of Georgia in others.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:04:04 UTC | #940042

Katy Cordeth's Avatar Comment 8 by Katy Cordeth

Prosperity theology is a false theology,” said R. Albert Mohler Jr., president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Ky. Between its message and its reputation for high spending, Mr. Mohler said, “TBN has been a huge embarrassment to evangelical Christianity for decades."

That must mean that.....

I wouldn't have thought.....

The Crouches should really.....

Ah fuck it, I can't think of anything to say that's nearly as funny as the bit that's I've emboldened.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:15:09 UTC | #940045

achromat666's Avatar Comment 9 by achromat666

Getting flashbacks of Bill Maher's Religulous just looking at that picture alone.

I was wondering where the torch was passed from the likes of Jim Bakker, Jimmy Swaggart and their sickening ilk. So very sad....

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:15:46 UTC | #940046

AlGarnier's Avatar Comment 10 by AlGarnier

Wow, and they say crime doesn't pay! Apparently only Christian Americans are gullible enough to buy their way into heaven and find out it was just a financial scam.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:20:26 UTC | #940047

glenister_m's Avatar Comment 11 by glenister_m

If god had wanted us to be rich, he would have made us televangelists.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:38:22 UTC | #940049

Zeuglodon's Avatar Comment 12 by Zeuglodon

Ah well, look on the bright side; rich people don't get into heaven even if it is a real place. Jesus said so in Matthew. Something about camels and needle eyes, I believe.

Capitalism and religion really shouldn't mix. At least the quiet churchgoers treat religious experience as something sacred, i.e. not to be touched by this kind of crass commercialism.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:45:22 UTC | #940051

Eyerish's Avatar Comment 13 by Eyerish

Unfortunately this is not isolated and I feel sort of sorry for the people who donate to these hucksters. I feel sorry that the followers have basically lost their money for being sold on the intangible 'false hope' of prosperity, but I don't feel sorry for them as they are no less greedy than the pastors; as they are praying (and paying) that God will give them money. The only difference is that the Pastors have figured out how to make praying for money work in their favour.

All religions sell their hocus pocus by promising things that they know they never have to actually deliver because all of their promises are for after the sucker is dead - and they aren't coming back to claim a refund from the religious leaders.

Sun, 06 May 2012 02:59:21 UTC | #940056

xmaseveeve's Avatar Comment 14 by xmaseveeve

End tax-free status for religion. Can you believe this stuff? They even ordain their employees for tax avoidance? Leeches. Truly sickening.

Sun, 06 May 2012 03:25:01 UTC | #940059

fullyladenswallow's Avatar Comment 15 by fullyladenswallow

All I can say is, "shades of Amway."

After looking at the park's website, I wonder how they get can get away with such a tacky concept.

Sun, 06 May 2012 03:29:26 UTC | #940060

rjohn19's Avatar Comment 16 by rjohn19

It is comforting to know Tammy Faye Bakker's hair stylist and makeup artist both found meaningful work after the collapse of PTL.

I don't really think these people are even true believers. B-movie actors- now that I'd buy. They just lack the sappy countenance of the saved.

Sun, 06 May 2012 04:17:36 UTC | #940067

mildcat's Avatar Comment 17 by mildcat

Religion in America is tax free entertainment.

Sun, 06 May 2012 04:30:24 UTC | #940070

IDLERACER's Avatar Comment 18 by IDLERACER

It's no use. If Paul and Jan Crouch went on the air and actually said "We don't really believe any of the crap we've been dishing out for the last 35 years, but keep sending us your money so we can continue to live in the manner in which we've become accustomed," their flock would keep on tithing, just out of habit. Frequent guest Benny Hinn's lifestyle is no secret to anyone anymore, and yet the cash just keeps flowing.

Sun, 06 May 2012 04:57:59 UTC | #940077

Jos Gibbons's Avatar Comment 19 by Jos Gibbons

This lavish aspect of some religious buildings was discussed recently in the latest episode of Real Time with Bill Maher. Maher's final "new rule" therein discussed when something deserves to count as a "charity", in the sense of donations to it being tax-deductible for the donor and tax-exempt for the recipient. Because such tax breaks amount to taxpayers subsidising such donations, Maher raised the question: when are you giving money to a real charity rather than, say, your hobby? I mention it because he gave a good argument for why religions don't deserve it. (Also, it was quite funny, because that's how he formats the show.)

The criterion he proposed is that, while charities are not the only groups that will spend some of their money on good causes $, real charities will put as much of it as possible to that purpose while pretenders to the title care more about "growing the brand". He also suggested an empirical method for telling the difference without looking into their finances, which is of course often difficult: if it has one or more large, architecturally ostentatious buildings (or, as he calls it, "castles"), it doesn't qualify as true charity. This is not the exact same word choice as "palace", as has been discussed above, but I think we can all agree plenty of religious buildings around the world qualify under some term along these lines.

On this principle he argues that, for example, the Mormon Church and classical music halls don't deserve such tax assistance when donations are made to them. The Mormon example, incidentally, is what made his comparison topical (because of previous statements he and other had made about Mitt Romney giving the church 10 % of his income; if only he would give that kind of money in taxes). Being a comedian, he concluded the discussion by arguing that "Unlike food or water, access to Mozart is not a basic human necessity."

If you want to see the clip, it's on YouTube here.

$ A point he could have raised, but didn't, in refutation of the "If it spends money on good things, donating to it is a good idea" argument is that Hamas spends millions of dollars a year on charitable activities. That was the example I thought of as I was watching, and now I remember other examples; Scientology offers some, for example. Long story short: it's an argument that is refuted with plenty of "would you give them money?" examples.

Sun, 06 May 2012 07:19:34 UTC | #940092

Capt. Bloodeye's Avatar Comment 20 by Capt. Bloodeye

I am unsure who to despise the most; the fraudsters running this scam, or the fools who fund it. The 'poverty of Christ' seems to be an outdated ideal. Truly despicable.

Sun, 06 May 2012 07:41:10 UTC | #940093

stratonician's Avatar Comment 21 by stratonician

I think Richard Dawkins' concept of the meme is really rather inspired. It must attain to currency in common parlance. Religion is in memetics, as a cultural self-replicator, a bad meme. It is counter-evolutionary, if we allow for ourselves the advance of understanding to claim its own evolutionary purpose. Religious teachings expose believers to this level of exploitation since they are founded on the faith meme, or "virus," as Dawkins likened faith to. Faith is not just simplistic, puerile,it is anti-intellectual. We are not to exalt the natural questioning mind over the mind of God. Our greatest endowment from all the rigors of natural selection, is our impediment?! Religion gives people a sense of belonging, at what a price.

Sun, 06 May 2012 07:42:32 UTC | #940094

Ivan The Not So Bad's Avatar Comment 22 by Ivan The Not So Bad

Best Christian theme park ever:

Tierra Santa | Buenos Aires | You Tube

Holy shit!

Sun, 06 May 2012 07:53:54 UTC | #940096

Premiseless's Avatar Comment 23 by Premiseless

You can see how the markets might invest in logical fallacy more than reason and free-thought.

The wizard is behind every curtain of power that maintains financial rules to preserve its holy rights.

Their only tax is that they act like a sky fairy.

Sun, 06 May 2012 08:43:44 UTC | #940109

Flapjack's Avatar Comment 24 by Flapjack

I thought I was looking at stills from MTV Cribs... are these the plans that Disneyworld chucked out for being a bit too much?

That front entrance is giving me diabetes. Just when you thought the catholics had cornered the market in OTT kitsch... I don't know if I'm more offended by the cash they waste on it or the taste free end result.

Sun, 06 May 2012 09:22:38 UTC | #940114

S. Gudmundsson's Avatar Comment 25 by S. Gudmundsson

Christianity: The theme park version.

I doubt those who practice American Christianity would even recognize Christianity as it was practiced in the Roman Empire.

Sun, 06 May 2012 11:12:25 UTC | #940132

jbkaffe's Avatar Comment 26 by jbkaffe

Speaking of families.

Iv'e always wondered how many different nationalties are "represented" on this site?

Maybe a thread where people introduce themselves would be a good idea....

A sort of "hello and welcome" to the site thread would be nice too:-)....

Sun, 06 May 2012 12:08:43 UTC | #940139

SomersetJohn's Avatar Comment 27 by SomersetJohn

Comment 1 by Neodarwinian :

“Prosperity theology is a false theology, '

Christian theologist says christian theology is a false theology!

Sun, 06 May 2012 12:22:12 UTC | #940141

Anonymous's Avatar Comment 28 by Anonymous

Comment Removed by Moderator - sock puppet

Sun, 06 May 2012 12:29:47 UTC | #940142

mmurray's Avatar Comment 29 by mmurray

Comment 26 by jbkaffe :

Speaking of families.

Iv'e always wondered how many different nationalties are "represented" on this site?

Maybe a thread where people introduce themselves would be a good idea....

A sort of "hello and welcome" to the site thread would be nice too:-)....

We used to have a forum but it was closed You can see the fossilised remains here. The site management aren't that keen on socialising. Have a look at the T&C's number 5.

Michael (Australian)

Sun, 06 May 2012 12:51:40 UTC | #940145

QuestioningKat's Avatar Comment 30 by QuestioningKat

Comment 5 by Cartomancer :

Clearly Hell does not exist. If it did then there would have been no need to build this ghastly abomination in Florida.

If there were a God, people with good aesthetic taste would be wealthy instead of trailer trash on a pedestal.

His and her mansions.....hmmm, sounds like a healthy marriage to me. I've heard of twin beds, but this is a bit over-the-top.

Who needs to be informed to get the ball rolling on ending tax exempt status for churches? What petition needs to be created and where? Do we write to our congressperson? Petition to put it on the ballot? Who in the media is willing to look at churches big and small and do an expose' of what is actually going on with a churches' finances. Is there anyone out there who would elaborate on the perks of mega churches down to the little start-up. No one gets a housing allowance. The days of traveling by mule and train are over.

I've said this like a broken record...expose the financial corruptness of a church and let people know what tax benefits churches are getting and people will wake up. You can talk reason until you are blue in the face, but hit people in the wallet and you'll see change. Bring up issues of fairness, and it will encourage people to strive for change. I once attended a church which split in half in one day after financial issues were brought to light by several board members, attorneys among them; the minister's response was less than welcoming. People reveal their true colors in these situations and others will take note.

EXCELLENT LINK JOS (comment 19) Be sure to watch it. Comparing the free clinic building to the Mormon temple...brilliant.

Sun, 06 May 2012 13:01:35 UTC | #940147