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← Thunderf00t is going too far

Thunderf00t is going too far - Comments

-TheCodeCrack-'s Avatar Comment 1 by -TheCodeCrack-

As a consequence I've taken down all of my own videos in which I mock Islam (note: Islam, not Muslims.) I don't want to be associated with this worldwide anti-Muslim zeitgeist which seems to be developing (on YouTube at least.)

This is confusing. You're taking down your own videos which mock a religion because other videos on youtube are anti-muslim?

You're not making any sense.

Fri, 21 May 2010 19:51:41 UTC | #472197

Lapithes's Avatar Comment 2 by Lapithes

TF's recent videos calling people in the Muslim world "ants" compared to us in the west as "Gods" are just hate mongering. His more recent video is just a pathetic attempt to get attention. Drawing Muhammad as paedophile bear then burning it and stamping on it, what is the point of that? To prove that people will get offended if you are deliberately offensive?

This was satire. To buy a flag representing a country and then burning it on camera is silly, especially because it is done all the time after every little thing that that some Muslims find objectionable. Thunderf00t wasn't just being hilarious by burning pedobear, he also made the point that flag burning is a vacuous threat and that people shouldn't fear vacuous threats because that is the only reason they're effective. I'll concede right away that Thunderf00t has been intentionally offensive but not that he is, or was being, immoral. He never uses violence, he never threatens to use violence, what he did was to assert the right to be offensive. To do that you must be intentionally offensive. When society promises to defend everybody's right to free speech and expression but in practice doesn't you must force it to confront the issue. It is a bit like the story of king Solomon. The mothers are society, the baby is the right to free speech and expression. Thunderf00t is king Solomon. The sword represents assassinations of cartoonists and threats of violence and murder. When society defends free speech it is the true mother, otherwise it proves itself to be the false one. When society understands it isn't the true mother it must choose between free speech or repeal of free speech, it can't say one and do the other any longer. At the same time Thunderf00t is exposing the insincerity of threateners.

Updated: Fri, 21 May 2010 20:15:07 UTC | #472205

locutus7's Avatar Comment 3 by locutus7

You can do what you want with your own videos, but TF and others are fighting for the right to "blaspheme" a fictional belief system as a form of criticism.

If islam succeeds in limiting our ability to criticise it by threatening death to the critics, they win the right to continue to commit barbaric acts under their religion - a religion you help to protect.

We should fight to protect all expression, especially that that offends us. Because if you silence the speaker, you not only rob him of the right to express his views, you rob us of the right to hear them.

Updated: Fri, 21 May 2010 20:46:19 UTC | #472211

Algeron's Avatar Comment 4 by Algeron

There would never have been a Draw Mohammed Day if the Danish cartoonists hadn't gotten threatened with violence in the first place. To add insult to injury, Pakistan basically took away the democratic power of its people by preventing them from forming an anti-group in light of this event.

This is what happens when a set of beliefs systematically gets sheltered from open scrutiny. Censorship is no longer an option in the 21st century, so if Islam wants to be treated with the respect it ought to deserve, it needs to learn to share communal space with the rest of the digital world.

Trolls die when they're not fed. Just shrug off the images and get on with your day.

Fri, 21 May 2010 21:14:11 UTC | #472219

secularenegadether's Avatar Comment 5 by secularenegadether

The first sentence of this article says it all. Therationaliser thinks he/she has something important to say.

Sat, 22 May 2010 03:06:56 UTC | #472300

evotruth's Avatar Comment 6 by evotruth

Sounds like you're suffering from the stockholm syndrome. Either that or you're a muslim trying to trick people into taking their videos down... Naa, i don't know, mabye you're just a coward?

I think you need to watch the video where a MUSLIM makes death threats to tf.

Sat, 22 May 2010 04:18:32 UTC | #472312

zengardener's Avatar Comment 7 by zengardener

Thunderf00t hasn't made any threats, encouraged violence of any kind, or broken any laws (U.S. Laws).

He has Mocked Mohammed, insulted radical, and accused moderates of cowardice and supporting radicals.

So how has he gone too far? By being rude? By breaking taboo?

Seriously. I could spend my whole day mocking theists and it wouldn't be enough. Insults and mockery are exactly what they deserve. For their beliefs, that is, no point in making fun of their dresses, funny hats, or bizarre chanting.

Sat, 22 May 2010 07:23:40 UTC | #472329

VenomFGX's Avatar Comment 8 by VenomFGX

That schoolboy was VenomFangX, so I think you need to look at the post in context before making such assertions.

Sat, 22 May 2010 08:50:42 UTC | #472346

J. Jones's Avatar Comment 9 by J. Jones

I think it all depends what your goals are. On the one hand, if you're trying to convince someone that their supernatural beliefs are irrational, obviously mocking them will not do at all. But this is not what TF is trying to accomplish, he is trying to show that mocking muhammad should be no more taboo than mocking George W Bush, the latter possibly having a better moral character than the former (which is saying something extraordinary). Is it offensive? Yes, and Muslims are more than welcome to strike back in a civilized manner that does not involve physical violence of any kind. It should not be outlawed, and should be protected by free speech, if not then I want to see Fred Phelps behind bars immiediately. This man and his cult would put a Nazi to shame, let alone TF, but we recognize their rights just as much as anyone else and leave them alone. When do you hear of death threats against them for desecrating fallen heroes? When do you hear of outlawing them? When do you hear of death threats against Muslims for the Burqa/Niqab or the killing of a teenage girl for the crime of adultery after being raped? Never. Oh, but we should all be so sensitively aware and ashamed of ourselves when someone draws a funny face of a man who may have never existed and long dead even if he did? Just plain bullshit.

Sat, 22 May 2010 09:04:15 UTC | #472349

J. Jones's Avatar Comment 10 by J. Jones

That schoolboy was VenomFangX, so I think you need to look at the post in context before making such assertions.

Ironic that your name is VenomFGX.. But calling him a schoolboy is like calling the devil an imp.

Sat, 22 May 2010 09:08:23 UTC | #472350

Dhamma's Avatar Comment 11 by Dhamma

Comment 8 by VenomFGX :

That schoolboy was VenomFangX, so I think you need to look at the post in context before making such assertions.

Oh, please! Don't tell me it's the real, all mighty, VFX that have returned. Last video I saw of him he confessed he was going to take care of his mental issues. Facing reality is probably not something he could handle right now. Good luck to that psychologist!

Sat, 22 May 2010 12:05:40 UTC | #472386

TheRationalizer's Avatar Comment 12 by TheRationalizer

To show that being offended by drawings of Muhammad is irrational the best approach is to draw non-offensive pictures of Muhammad, just like GoThatFunk did where he asked for stick figures (it's just a shame some people didn't comply.)

My videos mocked the belief, never the believer. For example I used special relativity to investigate the claim that angels are made of light.

The difference is like this

A: This is why I think your mom is not psychic.

B: This is why I think your mom is not psychic, and she's a fat ugly bitch, watch me stamp on a burning photo of her face.

Free speech is the right to open your mouth and act like an asshole, that doesn't mean whenever you open your mouth you should act like one.

My videos in future will be purely objective.

Wed, 26 May 2010 08:24:10 UTC | #473629

Ignorant Amos's Avatar Comment 13 by Ignorant Amos

Comment 12 by TheRationalizer

The difference is like this

A: This is why I think your mom is not psychic.

B: This is why I think your mom is not psychic, and she's a fat ugly bitch, watch me stamp on a burning photo of her face.

Hardly the same.....more like.....

A:This is why numerous stories in your Holy Book are bollocks.

B:This is why numerous stories in your Holy Book are bollocks, and you're a deluded, ignorant imbecile for believing it's true in light of evidence and modern scientific knowledge.

Updated: Wed, 09 Jun 2010 00:44:10 UTC | #478323

Ani Sharmin's Avatar Comment 14 by Ani Sharmin

I haven't watched enough of Thunderf00t's videoes to have an informed opinion about him.

About the topic in general, I support Everybody Draw Mohammad Day, because I think it's important to stand up for free speech and because I especially want Muslims to be able to criticize Islam and/or leave it without fear of violence. (I agree with you that it's wrong to blame all Muslims, especially when there can be violent consequences for those who want reform and speak out about it. There are those who may not voluntarily be following Islam but are forced to.)

There are, of course, people who will take advantage of such an event to actually be discriminatory. (As I said, I haven't watched much of Thunderf00t's vidoes, so I can't really give an opinion on him.) The idea behind the event, though, was a good one, and I saw several pictures that, like you said, were intentionally not offensive at all in order to point out the absurdity of the anger from some Muslims.

We need more secular criticism of Islam instead of actual discrimination. (If you actually regret what you yourself said in the videoes, then I could understand why you would take them down, but if someone accuses you of agreeing with people you don't agree with, you could just correct them.) You could have instead made a video explaining why you think the way a person criticizes religion is important, or explain that you support freedom of religion while criticizing people's beliefs.

Assuming you are also TheRationalizer on Youtube, I enjoyed your video The Quran - Muhammad's Geocentric Universe.

All the best.

-Ani Sharmin

Wed, 16 Jun 2010 19:41:33 UTC | #480973

VenomFGX's Avatar Comment 15 by VenomFGX

Comment 10 by J. Jones :

That schoolboy was VenomFangX, so I

think you need to look at the post in

context before making such assertions.

Ironic that your name is VenomFGX.. But calling him a schoolboy is like calling the devil an imp.

Not much difference perhaps

Sat, 31 Jul 2010 10:38:22 UTC | #494509

Dessicated Corpse's Avatar Comment 16 by Dessicated Corpse

This is confusing. You're taking down your own videos which mock a religion because other videos on youtube are anti-muslim?

You're not making any sense.

Actually it makes perfect sense, he doesn't want to be apart of or associated with a group full of hatred.

Sun, 18 Nov 2012 22:12:46 UTC | #951272