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A Most Courageous Human Being - Comments

AtheistEgbert's Avatar Comment 1 by AtheistEgbert

What needs to be done is that laws needs to be introduced to arrest and imprison anyone who conspires to murder or silence other people. There needs to be a distinguishing between freedom of speech and an activity designed to silence by force the freedoms of others.

Pakistan allows these mobster 'beards' to practice a kind of mob power structure without them facing any legal recriminations.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 13:53:52 UTC | #582918

lilalindy's Avatar Comment 2 by lilalindy

It is the 'mobster beards' as AtheistEgbert so eloquently puts them that do dishonour to Pakistan and the role of women in the country. It is them that should have attention poured over them, investigating and highlighting what they are trying to hide with there slanderous 'fatwa' smokescreens. I'm sure that every one of them has something to hide - the mufti doth protest too much, me thinks.

See also http://blog.dawn.com/2011/01/22/the-fatwa-factory/ for some more.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 14:27:48 UTC | #582952

Radesq's Avatar Comment 3 by Radesq

"I am a Muslim woman, and I know my limits," she said.

Want an idea how much work will have to be done to turn this mindset around - start right here. Even the "hero" of this story has bought into this ancient, tribal, religious, nonsense -- if to a somewhat lesser degree than her bearded brethren.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 14:40:56 UTC | #582960

Peter Watkinson's Avatar Comment 4 by Peter Watkinson

I found this comment on an Express Tribune Editorial “Stop gunning for Veena Malik”.

It looks like the female population of Pakistan is supposed to take on the burdens of society. This stinks of a double standard by the so called male population, they are afraid that the strong, independent self-thinking women will infiltrate the masses and using expected religious behaviour as a moral compass there is outrage from the religious hypocrites that are satisfied in screaming fatwas against her and turn on a blind eye towards the ills that are prime causes in our society. …

Another example of an “unbearded” voice and the more the better I say.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 16:09:45 UTC | #582992

Stevehill's Avatar Comment 5 by Stevehill

During the exchange, Qawi admitted he had not seen the clips of the show but had heard about it from others.

"What does your Islam say, mufti sir?" the actress asked. "You issue edicts on the basis of hearsay."

Oh well, never let evidence get in the way of an opportunity to put women in their place, eh?

Fuckwit moron.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 16:47:03 UTC | #583018

crookedshoes's Avatar Comment 6 by crookedshoes

Zen, Thank you for raising my awareness. I have learned today! I have learned that the vulgar head of religion can be argued with on it's own terms and defeated. I have learned that courage when mixed with anger and CONTROL is a very potent mix. I have also learned that sometimes SHIT SINKS.

This idiot cleric should slink back into the stinkhole he emerged from and STFU.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 17:12:27 UTC | #583028

Neodarwinian's Avatar Comment 7 by Neodarwinian

" The only way to talk to these bloody clerics is to talk down to them. " Indeed!

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 18:19:49 UTC | #583056

josephor's Avatar Comment 8 by josephor

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 18:58:08 UTC | #583081

ZenDruid's Avatar Comment 9 by ZenDruid

I have two bits of advice for Mufti Abdul Qawi:

1) Ask your mother to teach you some manners; 2) Grow up.

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 19:51:24 UTC | #583102

znack's Avatar Comment 10 by znack

Comment 1 by AtheistEgbert :

What needs to be done is that laws needs to be introduced to arrest and imprison anyone who conspires to murder or silence other people.

Then I think soldiers in Afghanistan could be quite offended at being arrested and imprisoned.

If you want to tinker or rewrite the constitution then at least make a little effort, right? ;)

Sun, 23 Jan 2011 20:13:36 UTC | #583112

crookedshoes's Avatar Comment 11 by crookedshoes

znack, why is imprisoning someone for conspiracy to commit murder against the constitution? We do not need it rewritten; we need it properly enforced (like most of our rules). Taking it to soldiers shows a clar NON understanding of the constitution.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 01:18:43 UTC | #583234

Randy Ping's Avatar Comment 12 by Randy Ping

Comment 11 by crookedshoes :

znack, why is imprisoning someone for conspiracy to commit murder against the constitution? We do not need it rewritten; we need it properly enforced (like most of our rules). Taking it to soldiers shows a clar NON understanding of the constitution.

Word.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 02:54:32 UTC | #583261

Bala's Avatar Comment 13 by Bala

Even the "hero" of this story has bought into this ancient, tribal, religious, nonsense

one step at a time. Frying an islamic cleric on tv in Pakistan is leap enough for now, considering her life is probably in danger now.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 03:36:02 UTC | #583265

Akaei's Avatar Comment 14 by Akaei

How does the Pakastani Constitution look upon coercion and slander?

Much like the US Constitution I imagine such things are deemed permissible when issued by a religious "authority."

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 10:34:38 UTC | #583350

lilalindy's Avatar Comment 15 by lilalindy

"What does your Islam say, mufti sir?" the actress asked. "You issue edicts on the basis of hearsay."

Really, this Mufti has established for all, the value of comments from all Muftis - they are inflammatory and ignorant and, if it was possible, such comments from Muftis bring Islam and Pakistan into disrepute and dishonour.

Malik said she had read the Quran and she knew what lines not to cross as a Muslim as well as an entertainer in South Asia. She pointed out that she never kissed Patel, for instance.

"I am a Muslim woman, and I know my limits," she said. The cleric seemed unable to respond to her flood of words.

Here, in the West, with our Haram, western values, she would not need to defend herself as above but instead, he would have to back up his assertions - they are clearly terminally flawed as indicated by his inability to produce any useful response.

Pakistan is an example of what Islam can do to a country - it is completely FUBAR. Examples like this are not really news as such, they merely confirm what we already know.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 12:37:42 UTC | #583409

lilalindy's Avatar Comment 16 by lilalindy

it double-posted that for some reason...

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 12:37:43 UTC | #583410

znack's Avatar Comment 17 by znack

Comment 11 by crookedshoes :

znack, why is imprisoning someone for conspiracy to commit murder against the constitution? We do not need it rewritten; we need it properly enforced (like most of our rules). Taking it to soldiers shows a clar NON understanding of the constitution.

These laws are already there? Without going against the constitution. It can not be that difficult to read. I was wondering what he would change?

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 15:32:56 UTC | #583502

DocWebster's Avatar Comment 18 by DocWebster

Comment 13 by Bala :

Even the "hero" of this story has bought into this ancient, tribal, religious, nonsense

one step at a time. Frying an islamic cleric on tv in Pakistan is leap enough for now, considering her life is probably in danger now.

Her life is definitely in danger just from the fact that she is a woman in a muslim country. Shouting down this cleric is likely just one more nail.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 16:04:35 UTC | #583518

crookedshoes's Avatar Comment 19 by crookedshoes

znack, conspiracy to commit murder is against the law. You can NOT plot to kill some one.

The thing I'd be interested in (and I think more to your point) would be INTERNATIONAL law. Whether we could get it internationally agreed upon and perhaps internationally enforced.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 19:31:34 UTC | #583613

VitruviannMan's Avatar Comment 20 by VitruviannMan

Comment 19 by crookedshoes :

znack, conspiracy to commit murder is against the law. You can NOT plot to kill some one.

The thing I'd be interested in (and I think more to your point) would be INTERNATIONAL law. Whether we could get it internationally agreed upon and perhaps internationally enforced.

I agree, but I don't see how such a law would prevent the Mufti from saying what he did. Even in a western society, he could very well defend himself under freedom of expression. Surely there's no law forbidding people from using hateful language...

I think the only way we can fight such dogma without becoming like them is through educating the people over whom they rule. Sure this would take a long time, at least a generation or two. But it would ensure a lasting modernization if the Pakistani people (or any other Islamic national) are educated enough to discern what's right for themselves, instead of us coming in setting the rules for them.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 20:12:17 UTC | #583634

Ungodly1's Avatar Comment 21 by Ungodly1

It is very encouraging to see a Muslim woman stand up to the religious fuckwits who want so desperately to rule all our lives. More women should be enraged by the way they are treated by Muslim men as a result of oppressive Muslim law, and therefore, be encouraged to join her in condemning these violations of their human rights.

Mon, 24 Jan 2011 20:48:43 UTC | #583657

HughCaldwell's Avatar Comment 22 by HughCaldwell

Not knowing the language, I could only judge the mufti on his appearance and demeanour. What a horror !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkVPTJ3-Vds&feature=player_detailpage

Thu, 27 Jan 2011 12:03:29 UTC | #584710