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← Eddie Tabash at AAI 07

Eddie Tabash at AAI 07 - Comments

deviljelly's Avatar Comment 1 by deviljelly

I really enjoy hearing Eddie speak, I find him engaging and intense, clear and knowlegable.

... and practical...

...if a bit "historical"...

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 12:57:00 UTC | #77177

eXcommunicate's Avatar Comment 2 by eXcommunicate

Eddie is great. His Galapagos lecture is a very good one too.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:02:00 UTC | #77179

ChrisMcL's Avatar Comment 3 by ChrisMcL

Eddie Tabash: The flaccid vestigial tail of the "old" atheism.

In one year, a small group of atheist spokesperson newcomers has done more for the cause of athiesm in America than decades of Tabash and his compatriots.

With that kind of track record, Eddie Tabash I salute you: YAWN!

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:32:00 UTC | #77183

ChrisMcL's Avatar Comment 4 by ChrisMcL

Wait, wait!

Here's a slogan for Eddie:

Winning the small battles, one distraction at a time.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:43:00 UTC | #77185

82abhilash's Avatar Comment 5 by 82abhilash

We have expert in philosophy, a science, a journalist and Sam Harris on our side. A legal expert has an important role in this campaign.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:48:00 UTC | #77186

Diacanu's Avatar Comment 6 by Diacanu

ChrisMcL-
Um....if the religious right turning America into a theocracy is a small battle, then WTF is a big one??

And if what he proposes to fight it is "flaccid", then what would you have? Open military conflict?

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:51:00 UTC | #77188

Veronique's Avatar Comment 7 by Veronique

ChrisMcL

Where the hell are you coming from? Tabash very clearly enunciates, for me, the immense danger that the religious right poses in the US.

Did you watch the video about the graduates from the Patrick Henry College and the cold, hard and disciplined founder of that College, Michael Farris?

Find it - it's called God's Next Army. If it doesn't chill you then you have lost the plot. Go and yawn somewhere else.

Disappointed in you
V

Edit Here's the link Chris

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7630851222567912489

V

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 14:27:00 UTC | #77200

Vendetta's Avatar Comment 8 by Vendetta

Diacanu and Veronique are spot on, I was thinking the same thing as D.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 14:30:00 UTC | #77202

JackR's Avatar Comment 9 by JackR

ChrisMcL, your obvious trolling is tiresome. Your avatar would also be better if it wasn't a cartoon.

I attended Tabash's speech and I found it compelling and disturbing.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 15:41:00 UTC | #77209

Zakie Chan's Avatar Comment 10 by Zakie Chan

I always have enjoyed watching Tabash in debates and lectures. Never disappointing!

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 15:53:00 UTC | #77212

USA_Limey's Avatar Comment 11 by USA_Limey

I haven't seen much of Eddie but I did like his Galapagos talk and this was pretty good too I thought.

ChrisMcL I think anyone who will put their head above the parapet and step into the firing line, (what awful cliches but I won't edit because now I am just laughing at myself so you may as well too), is deserving of at least some respect.

From my limited knowledge it is my understanding that Eddie has been fighting the good fight for a lot longer than lets say a Hitchens or a Harris, so lets give credit where its due old chap.

Rock on Eddie!

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 15:53:00 UTC | #77213

Summer Seale's Avatar Comment 12 by Summer Seale

Wow....

As somebody who watched Eddie Tabash a few times, and as somebody who is clearly on the right on some issues, and the left on others, and who agrees with Eddie's assessment of what we have to lose, I just have this to say:

ChrisMcL, you're an asshole.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:18:00 UTC | #77217

discipline's Avatar Comment 13 by discipline

We are so fortunate to have somebody so articulate and knowledgeable on "our" side. Great stuff.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 18:10:00 UTC | #77232

HappyPrimate's Avatar Comment 14 by HappyPrimate

I have not had the opportunity to hear Eddie Tabash before. His talk was fantastic. I can tell you from reading Joe Biden's book that he firmly believes in separation of religion and state and was instrumental in keeping Bork off of the Supreme Court to the point that he had to drop out of running for the presidency to make sure Bork did not get through the senate. While Biden is a catholic, he does not want any religion in government. I think most of the democrats running, if not all, hold this view also. Emails do work on senators as recently Sen. Vitter of Louisiana had to back off a funding request for a faith-based charity he wanted to put through because he was hit with so much email and other communications against it. Even here in RED Louisiana, we can make a difference. Vitter did call us histerical however but it worked and it was not funded. So don't be shy about getting the word out to your senators when the issues come up. And lastly, PLEASE VOTE!!!! It is not only a hard won privilege, it is also our civic duty. Kudos to Eddie.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 18:23:00 UTC | #77234

johnnyfatsac's Avatar Comment 15 by johnnyfatsac

Here is Eddie Tabash's interview on Point Of Inquiry. I just listened to it today and it was very good. enjoy.

http://www.pointofinquiry.org/

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:18:00 UTC | #77241

Last Man In Europe's Avatar Comment 16 by Last Man In Europe

It's an interesting history of how the separation of church and state came about.

I wonder though, shouldn't we today, with OR without what happened over 200 years ago, agree it is wrong to discriminate against someone based on their religion/lack of one?

One shouldn't have to go back into the past to know this is not acceptable.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:24:00 UTC | #77242

Diacanu's Avatar Comment 17 by Diacanu

I think the point of bringing up the history of separation of church and state is to trump the feverishly incanted lie that America "is a christian nation".

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:40:00 UTC | #77246

MIND_REBEL's Avatar Comment 18 by MIND_REBEL

Amazing speech. I really needed that.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 19:53:00 UTC | #77249

Cthulance's Avatar Comment 19 by Cthulance

I like how he casually, confidently and repeatedly refers to himself as an atheist. There is no mealy-mouthed pseudointellectual wordplay here in an attempt to hide his stance and that's so very refreshing.

Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:44:00 UTC | #77271

Theocrapcy's Avatar Comment 20 by Theocrapcy

What is AAI 07?

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 00:32:00 UTC | #77309

Acleron's Avatar Comment 21 by Acleron

Clear, compelling and very chilling. All respect to Eddie Tabash for his denounciation of the strategies of the religious right. The world's most powerful nation run by religious nuts is not a very attractive future.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 00:46:00 UTC | #77314

Diacanu's Avatar Comment 22 by Diacanu

I'll go one further, and say there's NO future for mankind down that path.
Dead stop, no wiggle room, no kinda/maybe.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 00:49:00 UTC | #77315

edwaltthespisactor's Avatar Comment 23 by edwaltthespisactor

in the UK we have a problem with right wingers claiming Patriotism and the flag. I was inspired listening to this speech to claw back patriotism and the flag.

Americans: PLEASE TAKE UP THE STARS AND STRIPES WITH 'FIRST AMENDMENT PATRIOT' PROUDLY TATTOOED, AND REMIND THE WORLD WHY THE USA IS STILL WORTHY OF OUR ADMIRATION AS THE DEMOCRATIC PROJECT.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 01:56:00 UTC | #77335

ChrisMcL's Avatar Comment 24 by ChrisMcL

"he's a good speaker"
"is deserving of at least some respect"

That's the kind of tepid defense that I expected to see. And it's the resume of accomplishments that many of the old guard atheists have to show for themselves.

Atheism needs leaders with a record of real accomplishment. Tabash and his ilk have had decades to organize atheist Americans into a serious social, economic, and political force. They have failed. They fight to remove Christmas nativity scenes from City Hall lawns; all the while, winning their little battles but losing the war.

Hitchens and Dawkins have accomplished far more in the last 12 months to further the atheist cause. And they have a plan.

Eddie Tabash bores me. But if that's the kind of activism that you like, then you'll always be an underclass. Enjoy.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:17:00 UTC | #77364

Vendetta's Avatar Comment 25 by Vendetta

I'm sure Tabash's atheist activism pales in comparison to yours, ChrisMcL, your highness.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:53:00 UTC | #77370

Theocrapcy's Avatar Comment 26 by Theocrapcy

ChrisMcL, what the frick is your problem? If you don't like Tabash don't listen to him, if you really are on our side (which I doubt anyway, you seem like a typical xian out-of-the-woodwork troll) then you'll appreciate that every activist for the cause has a different approach and every bit helps.

Now go and crawl back under your bible.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:15:00 UTC | #77373

ClemIsMe's Avatar Comment 27 by ClemIsMe

As always, good council from Tabash. And I can tell you from personal experience, where the intricacies of Dawkins and Dennet, or the intellectual bluntness of Hitchens and Harris may be autoignored by a lot of faith based people, the facts presented by Tabash are generally too simple and too verifiable to ignore. I have had a lot of success using his videos and articles - relatively speaking.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:43:00 UTC | #77394

JelloWasabi's Avatar Comment 28 by JelloWasabi

This was an excellent speech that is full of well researched information. Thanks Eddie! While many atheists were still not expressing themselves Eddie was out there fighting the fight.

ChrisMcL, I can not believe that you would consider the statements and concerns presented in this video as flacid. Unbelievable.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:02:00 UTC | #77431

Teratornis's Avatar Comment 29 by Teratornis

In reply to comment #81119 by Theocrapcy:


ChrisMcL, what the frick is your problem? If you don't like Tabash don't listen to him, if you really are on our side (which I doubt anyway, you seem like a typical xian out-of-the-woodwork troll) then you'll appreciate that every activist for the cause has a different approach and every bit helps.


While I don't agree with ChrisMcL's criticism, I can certainly see where he is coming from. Back in the 1970's, as I was being indoctrinated by charismatic fundy young earth creationists, the only examples of atheists I knew were Stalin, Mao, and Madalyn Murray O'Hair (and I suppose we should count Isaac Asimov as well, although he tended to mention his atheism only in passing, at least in the books of his that I read - he was an atheist, but not really about atheism).

I think we can all agree that Stalin and Mao did not exactly advance the atheist "cause" (whatever that might be), and O'Hair made her name by fighting for the separation of church and state while getting lots of media coverage which somehow failed to articulate the underlying arguments.

So the picture of atheism presented to me was that it consisted of tyrants on one hand, and hair-splitting legalistic manipulators on the other.

However, rather than malign someone like Eddie Tabash for fighting the legal fight, I'd suggest his effectiveness should be now all the greater, since The Four Horsemen/Musketeers/bulldogs or whatever we call them have done a decent job of explaining how theism is irrational. It is now getting harder for theists to mischaracterize the debate, at least to the thinking portion of the masses, inflaming them against church/state separation, as if this bedrock of the U.S. Constitution were somehow a threat to the fabric of the nation.

O'Hair may have accomplished something useful; I don't really know. She didn't give me what I needed at the time, which would have been more along the lines of polemic.

But I don't think we can blame O'Hair. We can blame the scientific community, for taking so long to produce someone like Prof. Dawkins. For centuries, science had tacitly declared something like a détente with religion, which was understandable after a few scientists got burned at the stake for denying geocentrism. While NOMA didn't have a fancy name until Gould gave it one, that was pretty much the principle most scientists lived by most of the time. Scientific skepticism typically aimed at the fringe of wacky cults, rarely taking on mainstream religion.

In any case, if ChrisMcL doesn't like someone's arguments or methods, what's wrong if he says so? He may have a substantive criticism, or he may not. We will only know after we hear his case. We can't have critical thinking without criticism.

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:11:00 UTC | #77483

ChrisMcL's Avatar Comment 30 by ChrisMcL

It appears that some things ARE holy. And for some atheists, it's Eddie Tabash.

Granted, my posts are provocative [dick-ish if you prefer]. But I hope that that didn't hide my fundamental reasoning. If Teratornis gets it, then probably so does eveyone else. So instead of making ad hominem attacks on me, tell me how I am wrong in my assessment of Tabash. Have his efforts as a leader among the atheist movement shown any substantive results?

Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:25:00 UTC | #77494