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[UPDATE] Islamic bore talks over PZ Myers

You won't want to listen to all of this. It is long, boring, and utterly unedifying except on the rare occasions when PZ manages to get a word in edgeways. I would have walked off after the first five minutes. Indeed, that is what I DID do when the same Islamic bore tried to give me the same treatment (see the end of this film clip if you can bear to wade through to the end). PZ has monumental patience and good humour, which I am afraid I lack.

The only reason to watch it is to see, in action, some classic tactics of the dishonest debater, which we meet among faith-heads all the time: gabble an unending stream of meaningless philosobabble, which says precisely nothing but is presumably designed to impress a gullible audience at home; constantly interrupt, within the first three words of your opponent opening his mouth; continually change the subject in an attempt (failed in this case) to wrong-foot your opponent; all the while, ooze fake friendliness and unctuous pseudo-reasonableness.

At one point, AronRa joined in and mentioned that the story of Noah's ark occurs in the Koran. This was promptly denied by one of the Muslim spokesman, and AronRa graciously climbed down over that one point, though not his main one. But I think he was wrong to climb down. The story of Noah's Ark is in the Koran, exactly as he said. The Muslim was lying, as faith-heads so often do, presumably again in an attempt to wrong-foot.

Anyway, here's the film, complete with health warning.


[UPDATE] TheRationalizer has provided some Koranic references, which seem to disprove some of the claims made by Muslim spokesmen in this film:

22m 43s The Quran does not say that mountains anchor the Earth

1. [Quran 16:015] And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you
2. Al Jalalayn : And He cast into the earth firm mountains, lest it should shake, move, with you
3. Tafsir Ibn Abbas : (And He hath cast into the earth firm hills) firm mountains (that it) the earth (quake not with you...)
4. Ibn Kathir : Allah mentions the earth and how He placed in it mountains standing firm, which make it stable and keep it from shaking in such a manner that the creatures dwelling on it would not be able to live

26m 50s The Quran does not deny evolution

1. [Quran 4:1] O ye people ! fear your Lord who created you from a single soul and of its kind created its mate
2. Al Jalalayn: Who created you of a single soul, Adam, and from it created its mate, Eve (Hawwā’), from one of his left ribs, and from the pair of them, Adam and Eve, scattered, separated and spread
3. Tafsir Ibn Abbas: obey your Lord (Who created you) by means of copulation (from a single soul) from the soul of Adam alone, for the soul of Eve was included in his . . .
4. Ibn Kathir : Allah commands His creatures to have Taqwa of Him by worshipping Him Alone without partners. He also reminds to them of His ability, in that He created them all from a single person, Adam
5. [Quran 6:98] And HE it is Who has produced you from a single soul
6. Al Jalalayn: And He it is Who produced you, created you, from a single soul, namely, Adam
7. Tafsir Ibn Abbas: (And He it is Who hath produced) created (you from a single being) from Adam
8. Ibn Kathir: It is He Who has created you from a single person, in reference to Adam, peace be upon him

27:20 No great flood

1. [Quran 11:42] And it moved along with them amid waves like mountains
2. [Quran 11:43] He replied, `I shall soon betake myself for refuge to a mountain which will shelter me from the water.' Noah said, `There is no shelter for anyone this day from the decree of ALLAH, except for him to whom HE shows mercy.
3. [Quran 37:77] And made his (Noah's) seed the survivors
4. Ibn Kathir: All people descended from the offspring of Nuh, peace be upon him.
5. Al Jalalayn: and made his descendants the survivors, thus all human beings are descended from him
6. Tafsir Ibn Abbas : (And made his seed the survivors) until the Day of Judgement. Noah had three sons: Shem, Ham and Yapheth. Shem is the father of the Arabs and those people surrounding them; Ham is the father the Abyssinians, Berbers and inhabitants of Sind; and Yapheth is the father of the rest of people


.1 [Al Jalalyn, Ibn Abbas][3]
.2 [Ibn Kathir][4]



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