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← Hitchens on the Catholic Church

Hitchens on the Catholic Church - Comments

Atheist Mike's Avatar Comment 1 by Atheist Mike

What strikes me when watching this video is that there seems to be some kind of unwillingness to admit any wrong made by the catholic church, it seems like it's still considered sacred and criticizing it is still taboo. Not an unwillingness from Christopher mind you, he did a good job, as always, exposing the Catholic church, but it seems to me that we still have work to do on our social consciousness.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 00:34:32 UTC | #852861

Anonymous's Avatar Comment 2 by Anonymous

Comment Removed by Moderator

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 01:03:22 UTC | #852864

Neodarwinian's Avatar Comment 3 by Neodarwinian

Twenty centuries. This said as if it is deep time. Their days are numbered and the count of these days can not come to an end soon enough.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 01:13:28 UTC | #852868

Alan Dente's Avatar Comment 4 by Alan Dente

The death knell of the Catholic church in 6 minutes. Only gets more poignant as more horrific news stories emerge

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 01:18:50 UTC | #852869

Daisy Skipper's Avatar Comment 5 by Daisy Skipper

There is no one else like Hitchens. There is no one else alive who can arouse such emotion in me in just a few minutes of speech. It breaks my heart to know that he is so sick....

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 01:35:58 UTC | #852873

KRKBAB's Avatar Comment 6 by KRKBAB

I have no faith, but sheer hope that Christopher Hitchens somehow gets through this and lives to a ripe old age. It ain't over 'till it's over!

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 02:04:14 UTC | #852880

quarecuss's Avatar Comment 7 by quarecuss

It's a speech like this that would probably have given prime minister Enda Kenny of Ireland the balls to get up and say what he said to the un-Holy See the other day.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 02:07:52 UTC | #852882

Anonymous's Avatar Comment 8 by Anonymous

Comment Removed by Moderator

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 02:18:22 UTC | #852883

rouey's Avatar Comment 9 by rouey

What's up with the Hitch? Does anyone know how he's doing?

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 02:24:22 UTC | #852885

SoHelpMeReason's Avatar Comment 10 by SoHelpMeReason

I appreciated how kind to and protective of Stephen Fry he was.

There was a moment's unease in me when I noted how many people from Africa there were in there. I remembered the overwhelming homophobia on their continent and I was concerned Fry might get a hostile reaction being spotlighted like that. Hitchens' demeanor seemed to indicate he was suddenly all-too-aware of this as well and I felt a subtle spike of concern run through his mannerism. He didn't want to be the reason for this. Or, really, for it to happen whatever the cause. Play it again, you can see it in his shoulders, in his voice. There's something different about his speech when he gets to that part. I think he ups his forward assault a bit as a result of a hike in tension.

I'm not the only one getting that?

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 03:01:10 UTC | #852893

Functional Atheist's Avatar Comment 11 by Functional Atheist

Hitch is on fire. At times, his vast knowledge can lead him down discursive pathways, but he stays admirably on-track for the duration of this clip. I think having a specific target to direct his remarks to helped him focus.

The topic sentence which characterizes these great words as a rant misses the the mark. A rant implies something noisy, wild, or excited--a demagogue rants. Hitler ranted. Yes, Hitch is emotional here, yes, he is scolding vehemently, but he retains much more self-control, logic and civility than is typical for a rant. The clip speaks for itself, but if it must be characterized I would prefer condemnation, reprimand, or, my choice, rebuke. A better wordsmith than me might have something even better in mind.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 03:15:24 UTC | #852896

El Bastardo's Avatar Comment 12 by El Bastardo

I remember watching that live at the time. Hitch & Fry, almost sounds like a Cop show.

@rouey, the last appearance listed on wiki was " In June 2011, he spoke to a University of Waterloo audience via a home video link". No hint as to how he's feeling though.

Hey, we're all dying, it's just we've been reminded of his mortality by the cancer. Let's enjoy the mans writings while we have him and let him enjoy his life as long as it lasts.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 03:24:59 UTC | #852898

Metamag's Avatar Comment 13 by Metamag

Comment 6 by KRKBAB :

I have no faith, but sheer hope that Christopher Hitchens somehow gets through this and lives to a ripe old age. It ain't over 'till it's over!

That's not very realistic, stage four cancer is stage four cancer.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 04:04:32 UTC | #852901

PeterAndes's Avatar Comment 14 by PeterAndes

Hitchens is a truly remarkable orator and possesses a brilliant mind. I also really hope he makes it through his illness. It would be terrible to lose him. For those of you wondering how he is doing, I suggest checking out dailyhitchens.com, an excellent fan-run website where articles he writes for Slate, Vanity Fair, and others, as well as the public appearances he does, are posted so you can see that he is still hard at work.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 04:25:44 UTC | #852903

Roland_F's Avatar Comment 15 by Roland_F

All said brilliantly and poignant and the voting at the end of the session was quite a confirmation that the Catholic Church on the planet is not at all a source of good but rather a source of suffering on our planet.

However – still the “infallible” head of the RCC the self declared “universal church” on our planet, head of a Mafia like organization responsible for the crusade, inquisition, anti-Semitism etc… the biggest multinational pedophile organization with systematic and institutionalized child raping as their main activity ….. obfuscated by “occasional charity” as Hitch put it -- this head of the RCC was invited last year from the UK government to provide British people “moral guidance” !! Epic fail !!

And this head of the biggest multinational - suffering on a grand scale causing organization - will defile the German parliament with giving a sermon about morality in a couple of weeks.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 05:23:58 UTC | #852907

TheLordHumungus's Avatar Comment 16 by TheLordHumungus

Even before Hitch or Fry said a single word you knew the catholics were doomed. I also really loved Fry's part. Here is a link to the first part of his speech:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEhtOhwL8xk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

You can also easily find the whole debate on youtube as well. You would be shocked to see the pitiful attempt that the catholics bring to the table in this.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 05:31:30 UTC | #852908

SuedeStonn's Avatar Comment 17 by SuedeStonn

After watching the Hitchens clip I thought it best to watch the entire debate... and was not disappointed. Stephen Fry did an outstanding job of presenting his view, IMO moreso than Hitchens, and swayed the vote as much. My memory stinks but towards the end of the fifth video the Bishop is asked a simple question... oh heck with it, just watched it again and Fry asked what the Churches stance on homosexuality was. This, my friends, was the true 'face' of the Church... that their doctrines are set in stone and they have every right to follow them, regardless of morality in the face of an evolving and still being enlightened race (mankind). If that (spoiler alert) wasn't the nail that sealed the coffin on the CC losing some 400 votes to the people saying that the CC wasn't a 'force for good' then I missed something bigger in the debate.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 06:14:05 UTC | #852912

cheesedoff17's Avatar Comment 18 by cheesedoff17

I'd give a Euro to know what was going on in the mind of the nun in the audience, her chin tucked in, not clapping when all those around her were.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 06:29:29 UTC | #852914

Stafford Gordon's Avatar Comment 19 by Stafford Gordon

Good to see and here it again. It's well worth watching the whole event.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 07:20:51 UTC | #852921

Southpaw's Avatar Comment 20 by Southpaw

A great excerpt from a great debate. Hitch is the master. His biography is out in paperback, a good read.

Some of Stephen Fry's points are also brilliantly put.

Clics: We didn't know slavery was wrong at the time! S.Fry: Then what are you for?!

And of course the excellent:

Clics: You always bring up child abuse! S. Fry: That's like a burglar in court saying 'You always bring up the houses I've robbed'

The vote at the end of the debate says it all.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 07:52:59 UTC | #852926

ChoneChacon's Avatar Comment 21 by ChoneChacon

I want to cry, thinking about how we will someday soon be deprived of such a voice. This is one of my favorite debates(if you can even call it that, given the absolute demolition of religious dogma and policy given out by Hitchens and Fry) of all time, and the thought that he will not be with us forever fills me with an incredibly deep feeling of pain and of loss, even while he yet dwells among us.

I am profoundly grateful for the technological achievements of mankind, such as youtube, that will allow the words of people like to Christopher Hitchens to endure long after his death, to the betterment of our species, and that of any species that eventually follows us.

@18 - What was going on in her mind was shame. It's that simple.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 08:03:40 UTC | #852929

gordon's Avatar Comment 22 by gordon

I was there. I took my son and nephew and they were awestruck as well as chuffed sitting a couiple of seats behing Darren Brown. The Bish gave up in the end but at least Anne Widdicome had a bit of life in her. Drivel of course but at least she had a go. Fry was excellent.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 08:07:20 UTC | #852930

Roland_F's Avatar Comment 23 by Roland_F

Comment 10 by SoHelpMeReason :

I appreciated how kind to and protective of Stephen Fry he was. There was a moment's unease in me when I noted how many people from Africa there were in there. I remembered the overwhelming homophobia on their continent and I was concerned Fry might get a hostile reaction being spotlighted like that.

Just came along an article in German news about a new homophobia outbreak in Ghana. Cheered on from Christians and Muslims regional minister Paul Evans Aidoo odered the arrest of gay and lesbians to "remove those disgusting elements out of Ghana's society". The head of the Christian Council of Ghana' Fred Deegbe warned that any law to protect gay and lesbians, as those "dishusting terrible acts" would result in gods wrath.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 09:56:59 UTC | #852951

mjwemdee's Avatar Comment 24 by mjwemdee

I was at Conway Hall for another debate, chaired by Polly Toynbee, which preceded Pope Ratty's 'state' visit to the UK. Austin Ivereigh (Catholic commentator and Press Sec to the Archbishop of Westminster) was one of the speakers in favour of the visit, naturally. Speaking against the visit were A C Grayling and Peter Tatchell. The RCC lot behaved in precisely the same way, either positing arguments thatmade no sense at all, or remaining silent in the face of cool reason.

These people are not negotiable.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 11:21:30 UTC | #852970

Peter Grant's Avatar Comment 25 by Peter Grant

Best rant ever! Hitchens is never afraid to offend anyone, loved the expressions on their faces :D

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 11:33:50 UTC | #852974

keymaker's Avatar Comment 26 by keymaker

Hitchens...

Born in sin...

Yeah he did make one mistake... Stephen, also, nodding away there - that the Church was "condemning my friend Steohen Fry for his nature..." and for saying that "you couldn't be a member of our Church - you were born in sin". The Church doesn't hold that people are born in sin, of course, or for that matter into homosexuality.

km

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 12:21:20 UTC | #852989

KRKBAB's Avatar Comment 27 by KRKBAB

Comment 13 by Metamag- "That's not very realistic, stage four cancer is stage four cancer." I believe you totally missed my point.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 12:40:52 UTC | #852995

KRKBAB's Avatar Comment 28 by KRKBAB

Comment 26 by keymaker "The Church doesn't hold that people are born in sin" You're not serious, are you? Did the Catholic Church drop the whole Adam & Eve part!

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 12:43:13 UTC | #852996

Marc Country's Avatar Comment 29 by Marc Country

Common sense.

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 12:44:02 UTC | #852997

keymaker's Avatar Comment 30 by keymaker

Comment 28 by KRKBAB

The Church doesn't hold that people are born in sin"

That's right.

Did the Catholic Church drop the whole Adam & Eve part!

Not as far as know.

km

Sat, 23 Jul 2011 13:03:59 UTC | #853008